Quote:
Originally Posted by Taxi
I really think this argument gets more voice than it deserves.
I popped in Bladrunner last night to initiate my new Denon 2500 player, and I was expecting to have to wait for it, even after switching inputs from Tivo to DVD, sitting down, etc.. Nope. The movie was already 30 seconds into the opening credits, and I had to rewind a bit to see the start. Cars, a Disney title, took longer to load for sure, but not the 2-3 minutes that some have said. I was not displeased in the experience at all.
When I bought my player last night, I compared it side-by-side to the only other player I was still considering, the Pioneer 95FD. The Denon is light-years faster than the 95, so that was the deciding factor for me. I will use Denon's work around for the LFE bug, and keep looking for them to fix it in firmware. (And even if they don't, I don't think it will impact me that much.)
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The BD30 and it sibling Denon player are the only two fast Blu-ray standalone players, I would not call them slow. And yet that does not invalidate my statement, (as I will expain in the next 2 paragraphs). However, every other Blu-ray player standalone makes the HD-A2 look like a dragster... Even the Sharp.
But the BD30 and the Denon both suffer from the LFE bug. The workaround (which I actually posted here before Denon posted
) is good for the Denon because the firmware was written to give the user trim control over PCM output, which unfortunately was not the case with the BD30 (Panasonic instead opted for this control only over analog). So I would say the Panasonic is flawed, Denon not as much.
But even the $1000 Denon is not the final Blu-ray spec. The only players slated to support BD Profile 2.0 the first half of this year are the Playstation 3 and Panasonic BD50. If the BD50 can ditch the LFE bug, I will consider that the
first Blu-ray standalone player that is not crippled, flawed, and/or extremely slow. The BD30 and Denon came close to this criteria, but in a couple of areas fall short of the mark.
Now, before you go off saying that you'll never download a Godzilla ringtone with BD2.0, realize that most of the authoring houses were adding downloadable OFFLINE features after the fact (i.e., such as popup trivia tracks) via HD DVD's online capabilities. Meaning that even with a "final offline profile" BD1.1 player, in the future you will likely miss out on offline extras that were locked on the disc or added after the disc was pressed. The same authoring houses that made those HD DVD online extras will be making the BD ones later this year. And before you cry "but most players aren't even BD2.0!" - they actually are, because the PS3 will support BD2.0 and it has sold magnitudes more than all the BD standalones combined.
While the Denon 2500 is probably the best standalone under $1000 right now, I find it unacceptable that I'd spend $999 on a player and still be missing out on future extras/features (both online & downloadable offline) plus still have no guarantee that I won't have to use a workaround for the entirety of the players life for proper LFE output... Not to mention said $1000 player has near-identical BD output to a player half its price and has DVD upconversion that fails most of the HQV tests - upconversion quality that loses out to a $100 Oppo, and is on par with $400 BD players... completely murdered by any of the $600 HD DVD players with Reon. I'm not trying to crap on the player you bought, I just don't see it as a winning purchase for most people because of all these issues. It simply isn't complete nor does it comparitively excel in HD or SD output quality, and it is all the worse with the hefty pricetag. Maybe the next batch or two will yield a player that makes the grade in
all categories, and doesn't cost more than an HDTV.
Its not because I'm cheap or I don't have the cash... Heck I'm sitting on mounds of cash as I just sold off most of my HD DVDs and all of my large PSX/PS2 collection (including the rare gems). I just don't want to feel like I'm getting taken to the cleaners with my purchase, I want to feel that I got something resembling a fair deal. For me right now, that would work out to the following:
$400-$500 - Fast, consumer grade BD1.1 player with no glitches or at least workarounds for them (i.e. similar to your new Denon but w/ panasonic build). Yeah its crippled, but at least its not too much $$$.
$600-$700 - "High end" build quality version of the above, or player that adds BD2.0, full decoding of all codecs, or Reon HQV to the above
$900-$1000 - Reon HQV upconverting, BD2.0, and full decoding of all codecs
$1200-$1500 - Realta HQV upconverting, BD2.0, and full decoding of all codecs
$1500-$2000 - I don't want to pay $500 extra for high end 7.1 channels of DACs/analog 7.1 I will never use
I'd say most of the BD players out right now feel like they are worth $199, the Panasonic maybe $299 despite its flaw... If Denon can come out with a successor to the their 3800 BD player that cuts the price by $500-700 by dropping analog 7.1 output, while at the same time adding BD2.0 and retaining Realta upconversion - well that player would most certainly pique my interest. Although with Super Upconversion on the near horizon it is even tough to justify spending that much for Realta upconversion that may be completely dated in less than a year.