Clipping, receivers, and you

[tomdkat]

Ok, in these threads there is some discussion of clipping:

Harmon/Kardon receiver question
question about speaker wattage
can someone answer my questions?

The last one contains comments from Pyrosecht about my particular receiver and clipping. My main question is, how do people find out the *actual* performance capabilities of receivers we consider purchasing? Was Pyrosecht right on the money or was he full of BS? If he WAS right, where and how did he get that info and how can WE get it to best know how well the gear we consider purchasing will perform?

Peace...

[Ruined]

Originally Posted by tomdkat

My main question is, how do people find out the *actual* performance capabilities of receivers we consider purchasing?

You listen to them before you buy them. Specs are BS mostly.

And IMO, Pioneer (which I know you are looking at) is a poor choice for audio equipment. Like Sony, they make great video equipment but generally mediocre audio gear (especially amps). I'd go with an Onkyo/Integra or Denon personally. In my case I'm using an Integra Pre/Pro and Parasound Power Amp.

[tomdkat]

Originally Posted by Ruined

You listen to them before you buy them. Specs are BS mostly.

I understand this but I'm asking how we, as consumers, can get the real low-down on how our audio gear is actually performing. Sure, I might like the sound but am I really getting the documented performance?

And IMO, Pioneer (which I know you are looking at) is a poor choice for audio equipment. Like Sony, they make great video equipment but generally mediocre audio gear (especially amps). I'd go with an Onkyo/Integra or Denon personally. In my case I'm using an Integra Pre/Pro and Parasound Power Amp.

Unfortunately, I haven't had much experience with non-Pioneer audio gear but the experience I've had with the Pioneer gear has been great.

Peace...

[Sehnzeleid]

Originally Posted by Ruined

In my case I'm using an Integra Pre/Pro and Parasound Power Amp.

Me and Ruined don't have to worry about clipping.

[firestorm]

I've never been brave enough to find the limits of my system, because it would be painfully loud. If a system is substantial enough, I wouldn't be too concerned about it. Otherwise, I do believe that a short period of clipping won't do any damage; never has for myself. It's continuous clipping, AFAIK, that will do serious damage. That should allow you to crank it 'till you get audible clipping, then back it down. Over powering a speaker won't "blow" a speaker; it won't cause the voice coil to seize. It can, however, cause over excursion, causing them to bottom out.

The sensitivity of a speaker (i.e. 89db) is the db produced with 1 watt at 1 meter, IIRC. Given that, the speakers max watt rating, and the amplifier's output, you should be able to calculate the db output by a particular "system". RMS and Peak should also be taken into consideration. The resistance (ohms) also plays into this, since output of the amp may be rated at 8 ohms, the output at 4 ohms is entirely different.

Also, another factor that plays into all of this is "headroom", and unfortunately the standard for the "large" (i.e. Best Buy, Sears, Circuit City, etc...) distribution channels is to not include that spec (Dynamic Headroom). This would relate to "Peak Watts" on a speaker. I'm a Yamaha guy, and that's one difference between the HTR line distributed at such retailers and the RX line distributed by A/V dealers. Your amp may have 500W, but does it have power in research for demanding peaks?

[tomdkat]

Originally Posted by firestorm

I've never been brave enough to find the limits of my system, because it would be painfully loud.

Same here. I tried turning the volume on my (now dead) receiver up to as close to 0 as possible (the normal listening level is -20db for me) and the closer I got, the louder it got to the point of my ears being overwhelmed. I didn't hear any wrong with the audio at all outside of it being far too loud. I don't recall what I was listening to. The sensitivity on my front mains is 92db.

Peace...