Unbiased Opinion Regarding The Current Console Generation

[187ontheVHS]

With all the debating that goes on, I figure this is as true as it gets from where I stand as an avid gamer for the last 20 years. Please correct me if I'm wrong or add anything that you feel I may have left out.

The PS3 and 360 are comparable in regards to the quality of games that can be developed for each console
Both systems have well built user interfaces
The PS3 console seems to have a better build quality than the 360
The PS3 works well as a Blu Ray movie player
The multi card reader on the PS3 probably doesn't need to be there
The 360 has a better overall library of games so far
The 360 would have probably benefited from having the hard drive as part of the standard spec for the console
Xbox Live is currently better than the PS3 online setup
The 360 works well as an HD DVD player, when there aren't issues with Combo discs
Usually the 360 versions of games are better than the PS3 versions (porting issues?)
Each console has some awesome exclusives
Thus far the Wii is a lot like other Nintendo consoles of recent years: a great system to play Nintendo games on
The Wii controller is somewhat questionable for use with "hardcore" games
The SIXAXIS features are somewhat questionable, and often feel tacked on
Blu Ray and HD DVD are more or less the same thing, aside from DRM concerns
Region free discs on each format are preferable

[Astrakan]

That's pretty accurate and a fair assessment.

The only one that I think needs some further elaboration is "Each console has some awesome exclusives". While that is technically accurate, the 360 far outnumber both the Wii and 360 in terms of "awesome exclusive" at the moment.

# of games rated 85+ at gamerankings.com:
Xbox 360: 10
PS3: 2
Wii: 4

As time passes and the PS3 and Wii release more titles, this discrepancy should start to even out. Oh, and I picked 85 as the cutoff for "awesome" but whatever rating you pick you'll get comparable figures.

KM

[Ruined]

Originally Posted by 187ontheVHS

The 360 would have probably benefited from having the hard drive as part of the standard spec for the console

This one I strongly disagree with. The XBOX1 had a builtin hard drive and for the most part the only games that used it were XBOX-exclusive titles (mostly first party). The vast majority of XBOX1 games only used the hard drive for savegame/replay storage and didnt tap any of the benefits an HD could offer.

In addition, the XBOX 360's devkit allows the developer to detect whether the user is using a hard drive or not, and if he is precache the assets to the hard drive - essentially giving the same exact benefit as if the hard drive was built in. To see this in action, try playing Oblivion normally with your hard drive attached, then detach the hard drive and try playing - you will notice the loading is longer, as the coding detected that you have no HD and skips the precaching.

So in other words, the devs that did extensively use the hard drive in the XBOX1 can still use it in the same way on the XBOX 360 using the devkits branching options - it may take a tad more effort, but the results are similar. Other devs can continue on simply using it as storage for saved games/replays as was the case with XBOX1.

On top of all that, the mandatory hard drive is one of the issues that caused XBOX1 to fail to keep up with PS2 in the endgame. It is optional now, so MS will not be burdened with that cost when it comes down to pricing your console in the $99 range.

I would also add to your list:

*XBOX 360 arguably has the best/most balanced controller ever released for a console (tho the dpad is a bit sketchy).
*BD has not proven necessary or even significantly useful for HD nextgen games thus far
*XBOX Live Marketplace > PSN Marketplace
*More work goes into XBOX Live Arcade titles (online multiplayer, graphics/audio enhancements, leaderboards, etc) than Wii virtual console titles which are generally just emulated ports of the original game.
*If you are interested in movie downloads, 360 is your best bet

[sub780lime]

Originally Posted by 187ontheVHS

Each console has some awesome exclusives

This is the only one I really disagree with also. While PS3 is finally starting to release some of its exclusives, many of the major franchises are now dual platform. Sony will have a few more exclusive for Christmas, but by far I think Microsoft has a much better library of exclusives and probably will continue to.

[MooglePorn]

While I agree with most of your list (and disagree with Ruined's entire post, as usual) I don't really see the point.

They all have ups and downs, buy the ones that have games you want to play... in my case, all of them.

[umainebearman]

Originally Posted by Ruined

I would also add to your list:

*XBOX 360 arguably has the best/most balanced controller ever released for a console (tho the dpad is a bit sketchy).
*BD has not proven necessary or even significantly useful for HD nextgen games thus far
*XBOX Live Marketplace > PSN Marketplace
*More work goes into XBOX Live Arcade titles (online multiplayer, graphics/audio enhancements, leaderboards, etc) than Wii virtual console titles which are generally just emulated ports of the original game.
*If you are interested in movie downloads, 360 is your best bet

Originally Posted by Moogleporn

While I agree with most of your list (and disagree with Ruined's entire post, as usual)

So even though all that is true you disagree with it just because its Ruined? Wow thats as you would say ... Lame.

[187ontheVHS]

Originally Posted by MooglePorn

While I agree with most of your list (and disagree with Ruined's entire post, as usual) I don't really see the point.

They all have ups and downs, buy the ones that have games you want to play... in my case, all of them.

No point really, just wanted to get that out there, people seem to forget the basics sometimes is all

[MooglePorn]

Originally Posted by umainebearman

So even though all that is true you disagree with it just because its Ruined? Wow thats as you would say ... Lame.

It's true because you say it is? I said I disagreed with it all, I never said "solely because Ruined said it."

The HDD in the PS3 is a good thing... the 360 should have had a standard one, to argue otherwise is silly, especially using the old hardware's "not always using it" as a reason, since... you know... game machines should get more capable, not less, over time, and what was a benefit then is even moreso now.

I like the PS3 controller better for everything but FPS games... I like the PSN more than Live Marketplace because it uses real money and allows you to buy just the right amount to get a game, not some even number... also the themes and such are free.

BD has proven useful in a lot of games, from uncompressed audio to massive HD videos all on one disc. Resistance used it to offer larger levels... Epic and Bizarre have both complained they ran out of room for textures on the 360. More space is good.

I like the new games on XBLA but Wii has it beat for amount of content and good classic games... depends on what you want on which you think is better, I personally will take Zelda and Mario classics over most of the new crap on XBLA.

360 is your only bet for movie downloads, since the other two don't offer them. Hardly a point of contention.

Is that ok? Are you satisfied I'm not disagreeing with him for the hell of it now?

[Wurms]

Originally Posted by 187ontheVHS

The PS3 console seems to have a better build quality than the 360

Not "seems", it does have a better build quality. PS3s dont spontaneously combust

The PS3 works well as a Blu Ray movie player

Works "well"? It is considered by many the best blu-ray player out right now.

The multi card reader on the PS3 probably doesn't need to be there

HUH? This is very useful for many people who are not home networked and want to transfer pics, vids, and music easily. I can take a picture with my cellphone, pull my SD card out, throw it in my PS3 and load pictures in less than a minute. Good feature to have. If someone doesnt use it, thats there problem.

The 360 has a better overall library of games so far

It has a year head start.

Xbox Live is currently better than the PS3 online setup

Gonna have to disagree here. PS3 is free, and to me that is better

Usually the 360 versions of games are better than the PS3 versions (porting issues?)

yea, porting issues. Game companies are lazy, so since more people own a 360 they program for the 360 first. PS3 owners get screwed over by lazy companies.

The SIXAXIS features are somewhat questionable, and often feel tacked on

When programmers learn to use it, it will kick ass. People said that about the rumble feature back in the N64 days. NBA 2K series is a good example of SIXAXIS done right. Best free throw shooting in a game. Lot beter then the old T/cross symbol and lining the cursor up.

Blu Ray and HD DVD are more or less the same thing, aside from DRM concerns

Eek, this statement could start a war if it was on another board There are more to them then DRM issues.

[umainebearman]

Originally Posted by MooglePorn

Is that ok? Are you satisfied I'm not disagreeing with him for the hell of it now?

Not really considering the part of Ruineds post I quoted was the part of the post that is ALL true. I mean he rambles sometimes but most of the time all the stuff he's saying is right.

Originally Posted by Wurms

Gonna have to disagree here. PS3 is free, and to me that is better

Ahhh yet another PS3 owner who has no idea what they are missing. The price gold members pay for XBL is probably one of the best deals in gaming history. The amount of content available from the market place , the XBL arcade games, the tv shows and movies to download. Oh and lets not forget the reason XBL even exists, playing games with your friends. The ease of just sending a simple invite to a friend to play is something the PSN will never be able to compete with. So free yeah it is but you get what you pay for which from what I've read is a big pain.

[MooglePorn]

Originally Posted by umainebearman

Not really considering the part of Ruineds post I quoted was the part of the post that is ALL true. I mean he rambles sometimes but most of the time all the stuff he's saying is right.

Point is I have valid arguements that show he's only "right" from his and your point of view... I have another point of view on those issues. I'm not just refuting his statements for the hell of it as you claimed, I have reasons for not agreeing with his suggestions.

Ahhh yet another PS3 owner who has no idea what they are missing. The price gold members pay for XBL is probably one of the best deals in gaming history. The amount of content available from the market place , the XBL arcade games, the tv shows and movies to download. Oh and lets not forget the reason XBL even exists, playing games with your friends. The ease of just sending a simple invite to a friend to play is something the PSN will never be able to compete with. So free yeah it is but you get what you pay for which from what I've read is a big pain.

Every single thing mentioned there except the actual online gameplay itself is free on 360 with a Silver membership. Gold is only for gameplay... you're paying to use your own bandwith to play online games, something the PC and PS3 do for free, often with dedicated servers, like Warhawk, which makes the experience actually better than 360 for free.

As for friends requests and such being things the PS3 will "never be able to compete with" I'm afraid your ignorance of the PS3 has got the better of you. It has friends, it has invites, it has pretty much everything the 360 has... for free. I will admit the user interface is not quite as slick, but other than that... The PS3 has been greatly enhanced since launch through firmware updates and people keep complaining about things fixed or added a long, long time ago.

[Ruined]

Originally Posted by MooglePorn

often with dedicated servers, like Warhawk, which makes the experience actually better than 360 for free.

And a year from now when the Warhawk servers are shut down as most have moved on to other games, you'll wish it used P2P because you'd still be able to play it online if it did.

[shnikey]

You can host games in Warhawk if you want to. So, in the oft chance that the games popularity drops so bad in a year that they shut down the servers in every region, the Warhawk lovers that remain will still be able to play.

[MooglePorn]

^Exactly.

Come on Ruined, arguing dedicated servers are bad? That's a reach even for you.

[Ruined]

Originally Posted by MooglePorn

^Exactly.

Come on Ruined, arguing dedicated servers are bad? That's a reach even for you.

They aren't bad assuming there are P2P servers also to fall back on for when the game's servers are inevitably shut down. But that does not make them necessary or better if your P2P programming is good - the matching system Live has generally ensures quality gameplay.

[Astrakan]

Originally Posted by MooglePorn

Come on Ruined, arguing dedicated servers are bad? That's a reach even for you.

I don't think it's that big of a stretch. I generally dislike playing EA games on Live simply because of the dedicated servers they keep insisting on. More often than not there's lag or voice communication issues. I suppose that might be more of a problem related to shoddy netcode by EA, but considering I rarely have those problems with traditional P2P Live games I can't help but prefer those over dedicated servers.

Now, going to Warhawk route and support both seems like a good idea.

KM

[MooglePorn]

Originally Posted by Ruined

They aren't bad assuming there are P2P servers also to fall back on for when the game's servers are inevitably shut down. But that does not make them necessary or better if your P2P programming is good - the matching system Live has generally ensures quality gameplay.

Pretty much every Live game I have played works like shit until a patch comes out, Team Fortress 2 being a current example. I've tried that game like 3 times and every match freezes and drops.

Live has some advantages, certainly, but there is very little it does that PSN and Xfire do not do, and they're free. On top of that PSN uses real money, not points, and allows you to buy things for the excact cost, not by some random point amount... Want a $7.99 game? Use your debit card for exactly $7.99. Plus the wallpapers and such are free, and Home seems like a cool option... That's why I say PSN is as good or better than Live.

[187ontheVHS]

Amen. Fuck points!

[Astrakan]

Originally Posted by MooglePorn

Pretty much every Live game I have played works like shit until a patch comes out

What? Considering you keep saying time and again that you're not much of an online player, that doesn't really mean much.

I'd estimate that about 70% of my 360 playtime is on Live, and only on very rare occasions have I had problems that require a patch to fix it.

It's true that the weekend following the release of a new game can sometime see some problems. But the vast majority of the time those problems resolve themselves, without the need of a patch, when the number of gamers online at the same time is reduced.

I haven't used PSN, so I can't say which is better or worse, I'm simply pointing out that even suggesting that most Live enabled games require a patch to work is a huge exaggeration. If it's true that most games you've tried needed one, you've simply had extremely bad luck.

KM

[umainebearman]

Well from the experience I have with the PSN and multiplayer I would say sure it has less drops and things of that nature for 1 reason. There are probably a total of 8 people playing multiplayer games on it. A friend of mine was showing off his PS3 to me and couldn't find a one of 15 friends, that where online, to get a game started. When they finally got it going sure they stayed connected because they where only 2 players out of very few I'm sure actually playing.

I'd like to see the numbers on a slow night on xbox live as compared to a busy one on the PSN showing how many people where online playing.

[sub780lime]

well I found this article about xbox live users, but its from way back in march:

we are seeing an average of over 2,000,000 text and voice messages sent every day between members on the service. The average Xbox LIVE Gold subscriber has 22 friends on their Xbox LIVE friends list. To date, Xbox 360 owners have unlocked nearly 300 million Achievements. All of those unlocked Achievements have created a total combined Gamerscore of nearly 7.5 billion”.

I couldn't find anything for the PS3.

[MooglePorn]

Originally Posted by umainebearman

I'd like to see the numbers on a slow night on xbox live as compared to a busy one on the PSN showing how many people where online playing.

Well... you know... there are less PS3s sold out there, so... of course there are less people playing online. Your post is an extreme exaggeration though, I never have trouble finding a Warhawk game, ever... there are a huge number of people online with that thing, much more than recent 360 games like PGR4 and Team Fortress 2 actually (probably because all the 360 folks are playing Halo 3).

And Astrakan, I didn't mean to say all 360 Live games suck and need patches, I was just trying to point out that using peer-to-peer can cause lag and such that needs ironing out in patches. I know TF2 is begging for a patch right now, and the other few games I have played online all got patches as well for performance issues.

Point is I don't like paying for peer-to-peer multiplayer when PCs and PS3s get dedicated servers for free in most cases, or at worst the same peer-t0-peer multi for free.