Sony, Microsoft discuss Blu-ray for Xbox 360

[bloodstainedwings]

Sony is in talks with console rival Microsoft about offering a Blu-ray drive for the Xbox 360, according to a senior executive.

After Sony's victory last month in the high-definition DVD format war, Stan Glasgow, Sony Electronics US president, said the two sides were now talking about Microsoft adopting Blu-ray.

A Blu-ray drive in a 360 would make Microsoft more competitive with the PS3, but it would also mean extra revenues for Sony's electronics division. It would also add further cost to the 360, meaning a premium edition of the console could be necessary.

A Blu-ray drive could be incorporated in its top-of-the-range Elite Xbox, or Microsoft could again offer a drive as a plug-in peripheral.

Full Story: ft.com

[Ruined]

It really depends on whether Microsoft sees it as productive or counter-productive to their business to add BD to the 360. Microsoft seems most interested in downloads as opposed to HD on disc, and on top of that BD uses Java which is one of MS big enemies.

Hell, MS they could even retool leftover HDAO drives to be BD drives. Obviously software won't be an issue being that its Microsoft.

[bloodstainedwings]

With Microsoft-supported HD-DVD now in format heaven, speculation that Blu-ray will head to Xbox 360 is now as open as ever.

The Financial Times in a Thursday article cited Sony Electronics US president Stan Glasgow, who reportedly said during a media dinner that Microsoft and Sony are discussing Blu-ray for Xbox 360.

But a Microsoft rep said in a phone interview with Next-Gen that that is "not at all" the case, and Microsoft will "remain focused on the games" for the console, not its movie playback capabilities.

"There are no plans to introduce Blu-ray," said the spokesperson.

"In response to Stan Glasgow’s statement that Blu-ray is a possibility for Xbox 360, we have made no such announcement," the rep added in an e-mail. "Games are what are driving consumers to purchase game consoles and we remain focused on providing the largest library of blockbuster games available."

[ganthc]

This is what I said in that other thread regarding this issue. If there is money to be made, MS will pursue that angle. Why not? It's not like it will hurt their download business. Those that want downloading can still download, but those that prefer to own the physical media will now be able to buy the attachments for their xbox360's. Clearly, the two can both be financially profitable for MS.

[Ruined]

Originally Posted by ganthc

This is what I said in that other thread regarding this issue. If there is money to be made, MS will pursue that angle. Why not? It's not like it will hurt their download business. Those that want downloading can still download, but those that prefer to own the physical media will now be able to buy the attachments for their xbox360's. Clearly, the two can both be financially profitable for MS.

1. Despite your logic, it will hurt their download business. Now that HD DVD is toast, 100% of XBOX 360 owners can only get hidef rentals through downloads.

2. It will not make them any significant money IMO. A Lite-On standalone BDROM costs $130 at newegg. In order for the addon to work right, it will need to have one of those ROM drives plus in addition to that the logic necessary to playback BDs (this logic is not in XBOX 360). On top of this, MS much off BD disc sales, they make most money off of the VC-1 royalties of sales of BD hardware... But this will be counteracted by the money they will have to spend marketing, packaging, and writing and updating software for BD playback.

3. It will be helping their competitor more than it does them. 360 does not need BD in any way shape or form. You will be able to get a BD standalone for under $300 this xmas... Why the heck would someone buy a $200 addon if that is the case? OTOH, Sony needs BD to take off as fast as possible since it is very heavily integrated into PS3.

4. It contains technology MS is at odds with, namely BD-Java.

IMO, if Blu-ray had HDi, Microsoft could and would come out with an addon tomorrow. But since the BDA picked Java instead (ironically I believe Sony voted for HDi), MS has little incentive to help BD since it contains none of their software development packages.

[Mr. Furious]

I really don't credit MS with being smart regarding video media. Comparatively, their machine is poor second place against Sony when it comes to playback of movie titles, music, and streamed video. So, for me, I'd buy a PS3 for BD playback before I'd buy an add on drive despite the cost. MS has a lot of work to do on their core machine before introducing new features. Just look at their DVD playback - it's horrible.

[ganthc]

Originally Posted by Ruined

1. Despite your logic, it will hurt their download business. Now that HD DVD is toast, 100% of XBOX 360 owners can only get hidef rentals through downloads.

Maybe, or it will force people to get a ps3 to watch movies they don't want to download. If they offer the add-on, they keep 360 customers from going to the "dark side." Hd-dvd add-ons weren't a threat to the download business. I know there was the secondary aspect of hurting Sony, but really, I bet it made them money.

2. It will not make them any significant money IMO. A Lite-On standalone BDROM costs $130 at newegg. In order for the addon to work right, it will need to have one of those ROM drives plus in addition to that the logic necessary to playback BDs (this logic is not in XBOX 360). On top of this, MS much off BD disc sales, they make most money off of the VC-1 royalties of sales of BD hardware... But this will be counteracted by the money they will have to spend marketing, packaging, and writing and updating software for BD playback.

It very well could. But they still will get those royalties off Paramount, Warner, and Universal vc-1 encodes sold with blu-ray. Spurring more sales via their bd add-on would be a multiplier for that revenue. The hardware could turn a profit. The costs for making bd drives is dropping more and more.

3. It will be helping their competitor more than it does them. 360 does not need BD in any way shape or form. You will be able to get a BD standalone for under $300 this xmas... Why the heck would someone buy a $200 addon if that is the case? OTOH, Sony needs BD to take off as fast as possible since it is very heavily integrated into PS3.

Yeah, but if it is a revenue stream, why cut off your chance to make more money to invest in other areas. You could even have Sony front the costs for your development and integration. I'm sure that is going on during these talks. Both sides can benefit from this.

4. It contains technology MS is at odds with, namely BD-Java.

Yeah, but the heavy users of their technology will not be using it anymore, so big deal. Hdi will not be used on blu-ray movies, so special features that studios were using that tech for will not be doing so for quite some time. And once again, MS may make Sony pay for the bd-java training to make the hardware compatible.

IMO, if Blu-ray had HDi, Microsoft could and would come out with an addon tomorrow. But since the BDA picked Java instead (ironically I believe Sony voted for HDi), MS has little incentive to help BD since it contains none of their software development packages.

3 of the major studios use vc-1. That might be incentive enough. But you could be right. My thinking is that it will be a chance to make money, and with the BDA possibly fronting money, it will come out with little investment from MS.

[bloodstainedwings]

Microsoft backed Toshiba's HD DVD in its losing effort against Sony's Blu-ray in the next-gen disc format wars, but it doesn't appear to be holding grudges. At the company's Mix08 Internet conference in Las Vegas yesterday, Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer confirmed that Microsoft will be working with Blu-ray, according to a Seattle Post-Intelligencer report.

"We've already been working on, for example, in Windows, device driver support for Blu-ray drives and the like, and I think the world moves on," Ballmer said. "Toshiba has moved on. We've moved on, and we'll support Blu-ray in ways that make sense." The report doesn't mention the Xbox 360 or the hypothetical Blu-ray add-on that has been rumored of, hinted at, and reported on.

As of press time, Microsoft had not returned requests for comment on the issue in light of Ballmer's presentation. However, the company had already addressed the possibility of an Xbox 360 Blu-ray drive earlier this week, with a representative saying, "We have made no such announcement. Games are what are driving consumers to purchase game consoles, and we remain focused on providing the largest library of blockbuster games available."

[ganthc]

Blu-ray works great on my laptop. I think they are referring to the 360. Blu-ray already is able to play on Windows.

[Ruined]

Originally Posted by ganthc

Maybe, or it will force people to get a ps3 to watch movies they don't want to download. If they offer the add-on, they keep 360 customers from going to the "dark side." Hd-dvd add-ons weren't a threat to the download business. I know there was the secondary aspect of hurting Sony, but really, I bet it made them money.

Buying a PS3 is $400. That is a lot of money to spend compared to the HD download that is $5. And, the PS3 situation is merely temporary. By XMAS when volume is high, BD standalone players will street $250 and less, making game console integration irrelevant. How do you expect MS to push a $179-$199 Blu-ray addon when standalones cost $50 more?

It very well could. But they still will get those royalties off Paramount, Warner, and Universal vc-1 encodes sold with blu-ray. Spurring more sales via their bd add-on would be a multiplier for that revenue. The hardware could turn a profit. The costs for making bd drives is dropping more and more.

But as a tradeoff they have to pay royalties to Sony and Java who are two of their biggest competitors, while contributing to the adoption of a technology that may slow adoption of HD downloads, the direction where MS clearly is going in the future. So I'm not sure the profits outweigh the long term affect of helping BD go mainstream.

Yeah, but if it is a revenue stream, why cut off your chance to make more money to invest in other areas. You could even have Sony front the costs for your development and integration. I'm sure that is going on during these talks. Both sides can benefit from this.

Again, they could make money in some areas but they would be helping their competition in others. Do you know that Windows Media Player still can't play MPEG4? There is a reason for that, and its not because Microsoft can't build an MPEG4 decoder (there is one in the Zune player). They did this with WMP to slow down adoption of MPEG4 and instead ramp up WMV/VC1 adoption - which worked as video download stores like Amazon Unbox and many other sites use WMV despite it being a Windows codec. Most of MS' decisions are based on longterm planning as opposed to short term profit.

Yeah, but the heavy users of their technology will not be using it anymore, so big deal. Hdi will not be used on blu-ray movies, so special features that studios were using that tech for will not be doing so for quite some time. And once again, MS may make Sony pay for the bd-java training to make the hardware compatible.

Regardless of whether HDi is used or not, Microsoft will be helping Sun by selling a device with Java in it. Microsoft rarely helps competitors, unless there is a very significant gain to be found for themselves. I just don't see that gain with another addon.

3 of the major studios use vc-1. That might be incentive enough. But you could be right. My thinking is that it will be a chance to make money, and with the BDA possibly fronting money, it will come out with little investment from MS.

Studios use VC-1, sure, but MS will be helping the spread of Java instead of their own software development. They may not want to do this, especially since VC-1 is a mandatory BD codec in hardware anyway and Microsoft making a BD drive would have no impact on whether studios choose MPEG2/AVC/VC1.

[ganthc]

Those are all good points. I guess we'll see what MS does. My guess is that they will make the bd player for the 360. My thinking on the download business is that it will continue to appeal only for 360 owners, but that MS will want to target the gamers that want to watch movies on disc media. Rather than have them potentially go to the ps3, they will offer an add-on to keep them "in the fold." I could be wrong, but that's what I think will happen.

[Ruined]

Ms just issued a general statement indicating that they have "moved on" and will support Blu-ray "when it makes sense" in their products. They said the same thing with 360 & HDMI, except it took a year before it "made sense" to them. We'll see what they think about 360 & current BDROM prices, and whether they can make enough money now to offset helping their competitors in some ways.

[littlebib]

Microsoft says no to Blu-Ray

Not so, says a Microsoft executive. "Xbox is not currently in talks with Sony or the Blu-ray Association to integrate Blu-ray into the Xbox experience," Aaron Greenberg, group product manager for Xbox 360, told Reuters on Wednesday.

[chlngr1970]

Over at Digitimes, Lite On is sayin they will be shipping Blu Ray drives for the next gen Xbox. Of course, both MS and LO are mum about the whole thing, but it is interesting that Lite On is a supplier of drives for the Xbox...

j

[dugpa]

So riddle me this Batman - for all you paranoid people who are convinced there's some grand conspiracy going on at Microsoft to destroy optical media and only do downloads, why would they release a blu-ray player for their xbox system?
Could it be maybe because there is no conspiracy. Naw, of course not.

[chlngr1970]

Because Oswald realy DID shoot JFK,,,

All buy his lonesum...

j

[dugpa]

Originally Posted by chlngr1970

Because Oswald realy DID shoot JFK,,,
All buy his lonesum... ;

Of course he wasn't the lone gunman. How could have had the time to do that while also faking the moon landings, covering up the Roswell crash and planning 9/11 with the Bush administration.

[chlngr1970]

Originally Posted by dugpa

Of course he wasn't the lone gunman. How could have had the time to do that while also faking the moon landings, covering up the Roswell crash and planning 9/11 with the Bush administration.

j

[elfman]

Originally Posted by dugpa

Of course he wasn't the lone gunman. How could have had the time to do that while also faking the moon landings, covering up the Roswell crash and planning 9/11 with the Bush administration.

That's great.

[ganthc]

Originally Posted by dugpa

So riddle me this Batman - for all you paranoid people who are convinced there's some grand conspiracy going on at Microsoft to destroy optical media and only do downloads, why would they release a blu-ray player for their xbox system?
Could it be maybe because there is no conspiracy. Naw, of course not.

Because there is money to be made in having bd devices for the 360. And it eliminates that bonus feature from the ps3 as being a deciding factor in choosing consoles. It doesn't mean that they support optical HD media.

[Jast3r Rogu3]

If that happends now microsoft has to pay Sony to include Blu-ray in the x360 hahaha love it.

just dont blame the RROD on Blu-ray, that is all microsoft they are still a bunch of noobs when it comes to hardware and the horrible x360 design proves that.

[Astrakan]

Originally Posted by chlngr1970

Over at Digitimes, Lite On is sayin they will be shipping Blu Ray drives for the next gen Xbox. Of course, both MS and LO are mum about the whole thing, but it is interesting that Lite On is a supplier of drives for the Xbox...

j

That article is slightly confusing in its use of terminology. It's referring to a "next-gen Xbox 360"... which can either mean that they're a little behind on the times and is still referring the the 360 as a "next-gen" console, OR that they're referring to the true next-gen Xbox, whatever comes after the 360.

Although, since it's also saying shipment of drives is to start happeing in the second half of 2008, it would seem they're referring to the current 360 and not some next-gen machine.

It just seems weird that a site called DigiTimes would be behind on the times.

KM

[ganthc]

Originally Posted by Astrakan

That article is slightly confusing in its use of terminology. It's referring to a "next-gen Xbox 360"... which can either mean that they're a little behind on the times and is still referring the the 360 as a "next-gen" console, OR that they're referring to the true next-gen Xbox, whatever comes after the 360.

Although, since it's also saying shipment of drives is to start happeing in the second half of 2008, it would seem they're referring to the current 360 and not some next-gen machine.

It just seems weird that a site called DigiTimes would be behind on the times.

KM

Well you could say that anyone that owns an xbox or ps2 would still consider both the 360 and ps3 as next-gen consoles.

[Damian]

Originally Posted by ganthc

Well you could say that anyone that owns an xbox or ps2 would still consider both the 360 and ps3 as next-gen consoles.

I think they should start referring to those as last-gen consoles.
PS3, Xbox360 and Wii and current consoles.

[Astrakan]

Originally Posted by ganthc

Well you could say that anyone that owns an xbox or ps2 would still consider both the 360 and ps3 as next-gen consoles.

By that definition a SNES could be a next-gen console.

KM