Study: Only 13% of gamers use console for movies, the majority of which use DVD only.

[Ruined]

http://www.thediffusiongroup.com/The...-Uncertain.htm

13% of gamers use their console for movies. Of that 13%, 75% are only using standard DVD.

[videoworx]

I'd bet 90 percent are using a composite connection, regardless of console.

[shnikey]

I didn't see any mention of % of people that use 360/PS3 to play HD discs. I would venture that more than 13% of PS3 owners use it as a blu-ray player.

I would also be interested in what these stats looked like back in the day when DVD players weren't so cheap. The PS2 was my first DVD player and I used that for 2 years before I got a "real" player.

[tomdkat]

Originally Posted by shnikey

I didn't see any mention of % of people that use 360/PS3 to play HD discs. I would venture that more than 13% of PS3 owners use it as a blu-ray player.

I agree since they use their Nintendo Wii for gaming.

Peace...

[Wirehed]

This report isn't seperating out next gen consoles, so it's kind of pointless really.
A vast majority of installed consoles are PS2s, which while the play DVDs, I doubt very many people use them for that TODAY.

[dugpa]

I use my Nintendo Wii for watching HD discs. I put them in and listen to them spin and watch the black screen for hours at a time.

[Wirehed]

Originally Posted by dugpa

I use my Nintendo Wii for watching HD discs. I put them in and listen to them spin and watch the black screen for hours at a time.

Tom does that and he doesn't even OWN a Wii!

[jriseden]

I don't get it.

If no one is using a ps3 to watch blu-rays, then how is it that blu-ray has sold more software when hd-dvd has sold more stand alone players?

[videoworx]

It means people that buy HD-DVD players, don't buy many HD-DVDs.

[Derb]

Not surprising sinse most do not care for movies when buying a game system let alone quality.

[dugpa]

Originally Posted by Seamonkey

Tom does that and he doesn't even OWN a Wii!

Neither do I.

[ganthc]

Yeah, this is the catch-22 that hits hddvd - 360 fanboys when they bring out stats like this to try and down the ps3's significance. Either the ps3 is a non-factor in the hd race, and so a tiny percentage of bd standalone player owners are trouncing the hundreds of thousands of hd-dvd owners. Or, the ps3 does count in the hd race, and despite conventional wisdom, people with gaming consoles do watch movies on their systems. Why would 360 offer movies for downloads? Seems dumb since no one uses their console to watch movies.

This stat is meaningless to the high def arena.

[Iguana Man]

Originally Posted by ganthc

Yeah, this is the catch-22 that hits hddvd - 360 fanboys when they bring out stats like this to try and down the ps3's significance. Either the ps3 is a non-factor in the hd race, and so a tiny percentage of bd standalone player owners are trouncing the hundreds of thousands of hd-dvd owners. Or, the ps3 does count in the hd race, and despite conventional wisdom, people with gaming consoles do watch movies on their systems. Why would 360 offer movies for downloads? Seems dumb since no one uses their console to watch movies.

This stat is meaningless to the high def arena.

I have openly changed my stance on the 360/PS3 consoles as being used and included as HD players, stats-wise. In fact, I've watched more movies by far thru my HDAO than I have played games. I know you ain't refering to me on this anymore but I do wonder how many here have caused your response above. Of late, I'd say few to none.

[ganthc]

Originally Posted by Iguana Man

I have openly changed my stance on the 360/PS3 consoles as being used and included as HD players, stats-wise. In fact, I've watched more movies by far thru my HDAO than I have played games. I know you ain't refering to me on this anymore but I do wonder how many here have caused your response above. Of late, I'd say few to none.

It's my soapbox. So will the eventual triumph of blu-ray over hd-dvd. I have a long memory on these things.

[Iguana Man]

Enjoy your soapbox when that time comes Ganthc. In the mean time, I'll refrain from posting more since I'm in a foul mood.

Enjoy your evening too.

Iggy

[Ruined]

Originally Posted by ganthc

Yeah, this is the catch-22 that hits hddvd - 360 fanboys when they bring out stats like this to try and down the ps3's significance. Either the ps3 is a non-factor in the hd race, and so a tiny percentage of bd standalone player owners are trouncing the hundreds of thousands of hd-dvd owners. Or, the ps3 does count in the hd race, and despite conventional wisdom, people with gaming consoles do watch movies on their systems. Why would 360 offer movies for downloads? Seems dumb since no one uses their console to watch movies.

Except you are missing the most logical answer in your black and white scenarios: That only a small minority of gamers users use their console to watch movies, however the installed base of said console is so large that even a small minority is comparatively a lot of people! Also, in specific reference to the PS3, don't forget that there is still only a handful of good titles on the system so owners are still relatively starved for content - again defaulting to BD as the way to use their $600 gadget.

This stat is meaningless to the high def arena.

Because this study's statistics defeat your argument?

[tomdkat]

Originally Posted by ganthc

Yeah, this is the catch-22 that hits hddvd - 360 fanboys when they bring out stats like this to try and down the ps3's significance. Either the ps3 is a non-factor in the hd race, and so a tiny percentage of bd standalone player owners are trouncing the hundreds of thousands of hd-dvd owners. Or, the ps3 does count in the hd race, and despite conventional wisdom, people with gaming consoles do watch movies on their systems. Why would 360 offer movies for downloads? Seems dumb since no one uses their console to watch movies.

This stat is meaningless to the high def arena.

Meaningless? I think the stat is meaningful but I think the PS3 "factor" argument has been confused (at least as I've made the argument). Yes, it's a fact there are far MORE PS3's installed than there are HD DVD players. That combined with standalone Blu-Ray players means there are more Blu-Ray players installed than HD DVD players. The thing I've always disagreed with, and that this article supports, is by virtue of having a PS3 installed, that DOES NOT mean that machine WILL be used for Blu-Ray movie playback. Yes the machine CAN be used for movie playback but having the capability doesn't mean that capability WILL be used.

So, what this article is saying is despite there being TONS of gaming consoles installed that ARE capable of DVD or HD on DVD playback only a small percentage of those are ACTUALLY being used for movie playback purposes. Of course, it would be interesting to see the numerical breakdown of the usage data they gathered so we could see what percentage of this 13% represents next gen consoles and what percentage represents older consoles, etc.

Back in the day, Blu-Ray fans basically held the position that by virtue of having the PS3 installed a Blu-Ray movie player would be installed and thus Blu-Ray has a much greater chance of winning the war. My response to this is having the PS3 installed doesn't matter as much as whether or not the PS3 is actually used for Blu-Ray movie playback. If there are 1 million PS3s installed and only 1% or 10% are used for movie playback, that's nowhere near as significant as 90% of those machines being used for movie playback.

It's all about the usage folks, it's all about the usage.

Hey dugpa, wanna come over and watch Batman Begins on my non-existent Wii tonight?

Peace...

[Ruined]

Originally Posted by tomdkat

my non-existent Wii

Sorry about that, tom

[ganthc]

It is all relative though. If we are to assume that the same number of 360 owners that purchased the hd-a0 so they could watch hd movies are the same or comparable amount of users that would watch bd movies on their ps3, then you have a situation where the ps3 is a factor in bd stats. If you don't allow for the ps3 to be a factor in bd stats, then like videoworx pointed out, it means that hd-dvd install base is not as loyal as it would seem, and that bd's install base is more loyal.

So let's just take the study for what it's saying. Hd-dvd install base is weaker than bd's install base as a result. Or...the ps3 is a factor. At any rate, the sales of bd movies shows that it's been constant, while hd-dvd's peaks and wanes based on promos that are offered. Either a smaller install base for bd is kicking hd-dvd ass, or the ps3 users are buying plenty of bd movies. It remains to be seen whether more game selections will equal a decrease in bd purchases. What really needs to be accounted is that there are plenty of ps3's that were bought solely to watch movies. The problem has been to get an accurate estimation of the numbers on this. But by not accounting for this in the study, the stats are irrelevant in my opinion.

[Derb]

Originally Posted by ganthc

It is all relative though. If we are to assume that the same number of 360 owners that purchased the hd-a0 so they could watch hd movies are the same or comparable amount of users that would watch bd movies on their ps3, then you have a situation where the ps3 is a factor in bd stats. If you don't allow for the ps3 to be a factor in bd stats, then like videoworx pointed out, it means that hd-dvd install base is not as loyal as it would seem, and that bd's install base is more loyal.

So let's just take the study for what it's saying. Hd-dvd install base is weaker than bd's install base as a result. Or...the ps3 is a factor. At any rate, the sales of bd movies shows that it's been constant, while hd-dvd's peaks and wanes based on promos that are offered. Either a smaller install base for bd is kicking hd-dvd ass, or the ps3 users are buying plenty of bd movies. It remains to be seen whether more game selections will equal a decrease in bd purchases. What really needs to be accounted is that there are plenty of ps3's that were bought solely to watch movies. The problem has been to get an accurate estimation of the numbers on this. But by not accounting for this in the study, the stats are irrelevant in my opinion.

I would throw HD DVD a bone in the HDAO department. (Count it) Toshiba is sadly the only company who has a standalone player. I thought by now more CE's would have jumped on board. Instead, the HD camp have just got re-badged players where as BD has more CE's. Still isn't much incentive for people on the fence to jump aboard BD when player prices are nearly twice as high as HD DVDs. The PS3 factor was a factor for awhile. The increase in BD sales (when nelson tracking finally started) were easily due to more PS3's sold. Content is about equal for both formats right now so the argument that BD has more of a selection which is why they sell more isn't true. The fact that players are ball park $700-1000US makes me think more BD'ers out their chose a PS3 instead of a standalone. This is 1 stat that nobody will have hard evidence of because obviously the PS3 can be bought for just gaming, but like Ruined mentioned in the past might be true also. The lack of PS3 games might entice people to make other use of their system in the meantime. Buy a few movies while they wait for games to come out. Can speculate to death this issue, so for now it matters only how many standalone players are sold in studio's minds.

[chlngr1970]

The CEs only count if they release product for people to purchase, right piratehunter?

j

[Iguana Man]

Originally Posted by ganthc

It is all relative though. If we are to assume that the same number of 360 owners that purchased the hd-a0 so they could watch hd movies are the same or comparable amount of users that COULD watch bd movies on their ps3,

I fixed that since it's so so clear the ONLY reason to buy the HDAO is for HD movies ONLY. There is a difference that is accountable in this regard.

[tomdkat]

Originally Posted by ganthc

It is all relative though. If we are to assume that the same number of 360 owners that purchased the hd-a0 so they could watch hd movies are the same or comparable amount of users that would watch bd movies on their ps3, then you have a situation where the ps3 is a factor in bd stats. If you don't allow for the ps3 to be a factor in bd stats, then like videoworx pointed out, it means that hd-dvd install base is not as loyal as it would seem, and that bd's install base is more loyal.

I didn't see videoworx's comment factor in HD DVD rentals. I don't know how many people rent vs buy HD DVD releases. Still, I'll go with your hypothesis that it's reasonable to map HDAO owners with PS3 owners who actually watch Blu-Ray movies on their consoles.

So let's just take the study for what it's saying. Hd-dvd install base is weaker than bd's install base as a result. Or...the ps3 is a factor.

Wait a minute. I thought you said we were going to take the study for what it's saying? It's saying far FEWER people are using their consoles for HD movie playback than thought or imagined.

At any rate, the sales of bd movies shows that it's been constant, while hd-dvd's peaks and wanes based on promos that are offered. Either a smaller install base for bd is kicking hd-dvd ass, or the ps3 users are buying plenty of bd movies.

I don't agree with this. It's clear people are very much interested in various titles being released (as we've gone down this path before). If Pirates had been released on HD DVD, we would see TONS of sales in the HD DVD column. Using your logic, by virtue of having more standalone players installed, HD DVD should have higher general sales because HD DVD player owners will simply buy ANYTHING that comes out on HD DVD, right? I mean whether there is interest in the title or not.

It remains to be seen whether more game selections will equal a decrease in bd purchases.

An increase in game selections might but games are not involved here. We could look at a PS3 vs Wii vs Xbox 360 discussion when talking game selection since that would be the more appropriate comparison.

What really needs to be accounted is that there are plenty of ps3's that were bought solely to watch movies. The problem has been to get an accurate estimation of the numbers on this. But by not accounting for this in the study, the stats are irrelevant in my opinion.

I do agree with you that there are plenty of PS3s that were purchased solely to watch movies. For the sake of argument, we could speculate the 13% cited in this article were PS3s that fit this category. The reason the 13% is of significance is it clearly demonstrates simply owning a PS3 doesn't mean one will watch Blu-Ray movies on it, plain and simple. The flies directly in the face of the early "PS3 will be the deciding factor" arguments made before anything hit the street (let's go back to Jan/Feb 2006 and earlier). That is what makes XBox 360 HDAO accounting so easy. People bought it specifically to watch HD DVD movies on it. With the PS3, it's hard to know why people got it or what they use it for. We've been arguing about this distinction for about a year now, yet you mention it like it's some new "revelation" or something. What am I missing here?????

Peace...

[tomdkat]

Originally Posted by Derb

I would throw HD DVD a bone in the HDAO department. (Count it) Toshiba is sadly the only company who has a standalone player. I thought by now more CE's would have jumped on board.

Agreed.

Instead, the HD camp have just got re-badged players where as BD has more CE's. Still isn't much incentive for people on the fence to jump aboard BD when player prices are nearly twice as high as HD DVDs.

Agreed.

The PS3 factor was a factor for awhile. The increase in BD sales (when nelson tracking finally started) were easily due to more PS3's sold.

The only way to measure this is to focus on "catalog" Blu-Ray title sales changes after the PS3 came out. Titles like Fifth Element, for example.

Content is about equal for both formats right now so the argument that BD has more of a selection which is why they sell more isn't true.

I disagree. "selection" has two aspects: number of titles available, which particular titles are available. Universal could release TONS of titles very few are interested in and I doubt they would rent or sell much, if at all. Blu-Ray has some very attractive titles in its stable right now.

The fact that players are ball park $700-1000US makes me think more BD'ers out their chose a PS3 instead of a standalone.

Why would you think this?

The lack of PS3 games might entice people to make other use of their system in the meantime. Buy a few movies while they wait for games to come out.

This doesn't make sense to me. When the PS3 first came out, it was "hot" so it was pricy. If the game selection wasn't appealing why fork over the money on the PS3 when you could wait and get it cheaper later? Or are we talking about gamers acting as EAs as we are for those interested in HD movie playback?

Peace...