Combos, What Went Wrong?

[chlngr1970]

Moogs got to it before I did, and posted in the Universal reissue thread. I thought it warranted it's own discussion thread, so here it is.

What Went Wrong from Highdef Digest.

j

[Derb]

Finally read it & responded to the thread created over at HDD.

From Josh's Commentary,

If it were really a physical manufacturing error on certain copies, how could a firmware change in the player make a difference?

The laser can be adjusted to focus on the disc surface differently than single-sided discs via firmware. I totally understand how frustrating it must be to put a HD DVD combo disc in the player & always think this before you close the tray. Will the disc load up? If it does, will I run into any kind of playback issues? If I have no issues, well.. (take deep breath) fewwwwwwwww. Why should us consumers have to even think there is a chance a disc may not playback in its entirely without a glitch?

Not long ago, I re-bought every single Warner, Paramount, Magnolia, & other misc titles that I owned on the HD DVD format to Blu-ray. Of course just as I received all my BDs, Paramount goes HD DVD exclusive. Every single disc people have said they have had issues with playback, I have had. This isn't some internet conspiracy, its reality.

The big problem I suspect is that HD DVD is replicated in the same fashion as DVD. How do you put a new format on an existing line of DVD-only replicators? Modify them. Does Blu-ray require any modifications to their replicating facilities? No, they have an entirely new method of replicating discs to mandate the format's structural properties & because of that, I believe its the main reason I have had less problems with Blu-ray discs.

[MooglePorn]

The article hits every main thing I have against them, so I feel no need to repeat it. Bad for consumers, bad for HD DVD... but that's just me.

[pizza]

Originally Posted by MooglePorn

The article hits every main thing I have against them, so I feel no need to repeat it. Bad for consumers, bad for HD DVD... but that's just me.

Great article. Actually, I fear all things double-sided in home video. I hate flippers. I remember when I got T2 and it came with a note in the case stating that some sets will have the DVD-18 disc and others will have 2 seperate disc. I felt I lost when I saw that I got the DVD-18. (Wasn't this the first release to use DVD-18?) The one thing I will disagree with Zyber is on the artwork on one side. Yes, it's true that for the two hours it's in the player you can't see the disc. In my house, the other 22 hours the disc is in a binder, so it makes it a lot easier to find when it sports screened artwork.

[chlngr1970]

That is the first reasonable argument I have heard for disc art. I hadn't thought if binders as a solution as opposed to having shelves dedicated to a DVD collection. I should have thought of it sooner as I use to cary a rather large collection in a binder with me when I traveled. Now I just rip and store on external HDDs. MUCH lighter on the back when I want to carry around a large selection ( Hey, I like to have my options ) )

j

[dugpa]

Originally Posted by pizza

I remember when I got T2 and it came with a note in the case stating that some sets will have the DVD-18 disc and others will have 2 seperate disc. (Wasn't this the first release to use DVD-18?)

The Stand was the first DVD-18. The original release of T2 was however the first DVD-9.

[jriseden]

The combos sounded like a good idea on paper 18 months ago, but after the playback issues, and the higher prices, and Universal putting them on releases like catalog titles where most people didn't want the combo, it just created a big negative perception that is probably impossible to overcome at this point.

Hd dvd should just bury the combo and move on. Since their whole mantra is "price is all that matters" then they should definately just move to the lower priced hd only releases.

[Iguana Man]

I don't know if I support combos or not, I've only got like 5-10 of them, however, my neighbor just borrowed The Hitcher and he will be able to watch it later in SD.

Seems pretty cool to me that I can loan out a HD disc that CAN be played in his HT. He asked me about HD. He said why can't I play it? I got a HD TV? HA!

Education people. EduFuckination.

Now he's a 'thinking'.

[jriseden]

Originally Posted by Iguana Man

Seems pretty cool to me that I can loan out a HD disc that CAN be played in his HT. He asked me about HD. He said why can't I play it? I got a HD TV? HA!

Education people. EduFuckination.

Now he's a 'thinking'.

Haha, good story Iggy. I have also run into a few people as well who get confused by the dvd in "hd-dvd" and think since it's a dvd it must play in their player. I guess that is the only disadvantage to using the established dvd name.

[SilentBob]

Well from reports at AVSForum. Warner Bros will now be pricing their combo releases at the same LOWER priced Blu-ray edition. Finally someone is seeing a bit of light in the matter

[Iguana Man]

Originally Posted by SilentBob

Well from reports at AVSForum. Warner Bros will now be pricing their combo releases at the same LOWER priced Blu-ray edition. Finally someone is seeing a bit of light in the matter

Now that should settle it then, no? Same price, two versions. To me that is perfectly acceptable and actually seems like you get two for one. Loan it to your friend, play it in your HD HT, play it in your non HD 'other' room, whatever.

As long as I can clearly read which side is which ( ) and since I really don't feel cover art is all that important, it's a win, win.

[chlngr1970]

Originally Posted by SilentBob

Well from reports at AVSForum. Warner Bros will now be pricing their combo releases at the same LOWER priced Blu-ray edition. Finally someone is seeing a bit of light in the matter

This will shut up a few naysayers, but I think the more vocal ones here will still pan Combos.

j

[sub780lime]

Originally Posted by Iguana Man

Now that should settle it then, no? Same price, two versions. To me that is perfectly acceptable and actually seems like you get two for one. Loan it to your friend, play it in your HD HT, play it in your non HD 'other' room, whatever.

As long as I can clearly read which side is which ( ) and since I really don't feel cover art is all that important, it's a win, win.

I agree. They could have been marketing as 2 for the price of 1 for a long time now and probably increased theirs sales considerable. I could easily see them having equal market share with BD software if all studios would do this.

[ganthc]

Originally Posted by sub780lime

They could have been marketing as 2 for the price of 1 for a long time now and probably increased theirs sales considerable.

Agreed.

I could easily see them having equal market share with BD software if all studios would do this.

Disagreed. We still are only dealing with 2.5 exclusive studios here for hd-dvd versus 3.5 for blu-ray. The fall behind in software sales is not due to combo discs.

[sub780lime]

Originally Posted by ganthc

Disagreed. We still are only dealing with 2.5 exclusive studios here for hd-dvd versus 3.5 for blu-ray. The fall behind in software sales is not due to combo discs.

Could the illusion of 2 for the price of 1 improve the sales dual format releases for HD-DVD. I think so. I think the foundation has already been laid and that hurts. When more companies were dual format (Paramount, Dreamworks, etc) the sales of HD-DVD's on dual formats could have increased significantly with such a marketing ploy.

[Iguana Man]

Originally Posted by sub780lime

Could the illusion of 2 for the price of 1 improve the sales dual format releases for HD-DVD. I think so. I think the foundation has already been laid and that hurts. When more companies were dual format (Paramount, Dreamworks, etc) the sales of HD-DVD's on dual formats could have increased significantly with such a marketing ploy.

I don't see it that way (bolded) nor do I think J6P will. Think about it. No ploy, just two editions for the same price. One that plays in your kids bedroom and via your soon to be HD setup. "Soon to be" is where the money comes from since HD sets are selling like pancakes do at your local IHOP of late.

Just a thought!

[sub780lime]

Originally Posted by Iguana Man

I don't see it that way (bolded) nor do I think J6P will. Think about it. No ploy, just two editions for the same price. One that plays in your kids bedroom and via your soon to be HD setup. "Soon to be" is where the money comes from since HD sets are selling like pancakes do at your local IHOP of late.

Just a thought!

Interesting. I think it can be a ploy for those less educated, but I guess there is really no untruths in there so...I see your point. I will leave it at that.

[MooglePorn]

I'd still rather have cover art and I still think dual-sided discs are easier to mess up, but if the prices are the same as non-combos I can't really complain. I hope stores reflect the change (and lower Universal titles as well).