Goodbye DVD - It Was Great Knowing You....

[projectmolcos]

Dear Guys





Many thanks to all of you for the generous and intelligent responses to my Does DVD Need
STAR WARS and What’s Your Dream DVD Special Edition topics that have appeared in these forums (and thank you, DVDFile, for the opportunity to air them to begin with). I hope for a particularly strong debate on this one!

Please bear in mind that I speak principally from a British viewpoint here, but I’m certain that a lot of what I’m about to say here is highly relevant to you in America and elsewhere. Also, I’m fairly sure that, as forum members, we represent the hard-core enthusiasts of the format, we are passionate about it, we take the format SERIOUSLY.

However, let’s step back a bit from that and put ourselves in the shoes of Mr. & Mrs. Joe
Average, who’s just come back from Circuit City with their new player. It’s them I’m really thinking about in writing this topic. After all, like it or not, it’s them and not us that that will truly ensure the future of the format – or not……

As it says, the title of this topic is Goodbye DVD – It Was Great Knowing You. I’ve been a DVD user for some time now, and, at the start, I would have said that the format had nothing but the rosiest of futures (regional coding notwithstanding) and was all set to kill off VHS as a home format. However, recent experiences, coupled with some unwelcome trends, have prompted me to think again, namely that the format’s future isn’t quite so assured after all.

Come on Projectmolcos, I hear you say, how can you even remotely begin to say that? The
format’s outstripped even the most optimistic sales projections, there’s nearly 12 million+
players in the US alone, there’s a plethora of software that’s achieving phenomenal sales
and, don’t forget, DVD has both gained the support of the creative community in Hollywood, while the studios are laissez-faire about the upcoming strikes thanks to the money they’re making from the format. If that isn’t a rosy future for DVD, then what is? Let me explain why…..

One. First up is the general looseness of the format. In their desire to make it all things to all men, the creators of DVD have unfortunately had to make it so loose that, even now, we still have teething troubles with the format – nearly four years after the fact. I agree that this has become less of a problem nowadays, and that most discs will play fine on most machines, but this just isn’t good enough, especially after four years after the fact. Four years and we still
have troubles? Not good enough! We shouldn't have had them to start with! I suppose some of us will say that that’s a problem which will recede in time. But, given the format is so loose, I would very much beg to differ, and say that remains to be seen. Who knows, as producers try more ambitious things with the discs, they may actually INCREASE.

Two. Which neatly brings me to……..Disc compatibility (or lack thereof). Ah, yes, the old chestnut. While many of us may be more sanguine about this than most (we’re all PC/Mac users here, right?), it’s incredulous that so many bought into a format where it still isn’t guaranteed that the software will play perfectly on the hardware when you get it home. Just imagine, would things like VHS and the PlayStation have been successful as they were if they still had problems years after their launch? Would they hell!

I’m not just talking about things like THE MATRIX and T2, where the ambition got the better of the producers and we ended up paying the price (and how!), but I’m finding myself taking back an increasing number of plain ordinary discs to the shops for refunds, and that I’m not the only one doing this, not by a long shot. What’s happened to the quality control?

Three. As we know, DVD is thriving at this juncture in time, and the studios just love it. However, it’s a nice big Goose that’s laying the Golden Eggs, and I can see the studios sharpening their knives to kill it. First off is the trend of re-releasing no-extras editions of things like BAD BOYS with bells-and-whistles issues some months later. Now this trend is spreading to movies that were GOOD discs to start with, such as STARSHIP TROOPERS and THE MUMMY.

Now, I know that some will be glad to have these new editions, but I couldn’t disagree more. At best, it just shows how inept the studios were and are with the format, and, at worst, it’s a hugely insulting lack of respect for the customer that verges on the cynical. Nice way of saying thanks for the custom. Either way, I’ve since decided that I won’t buy such discs, as I feel it would be rewarding their ineptness and/or money grubbing. How about joining me, because if we don’t take a stand, then they’ll keep on doing this. And I don’t have a bottomless pocket. By the way, anyone for rental windows? We’ve had them here for quite
some time and I’m given to understand that they’ll soon be making an appearance in America, thanks to Blockbuster Video.

So there you have it, just some of the potential nails in DVD’s coffin, and quite a few things that are guaranteed to piss everyone off. And, if an enthusiast like me is saying all this, then what will Mr. and Mrs. Joe Average make of DVD? They might just decide they’re better off sticking with VHS and, if this happens, we can kiss the format’s long-term future goodbye. I hope I’m wrong on all the above counts, but for the reasons mentioned, I do feel I have some
justification to say what I say. If you feel different, please write in here!



Best wishes





Projectmolcos

[This message has been edited by projectmolcos (edited 05-21-2001).]

[Templar]

I disagree with some of your statements, although it did make me think wheather I was just saying it because I love DVD so much but...

Originally posted by projectmolcos:

...there’s nearly 12 million+
players in the US alone...

Not to get nit-picky but that's more like 17 million.

Originally posted by projectmolcos:
First up is the general looseness of the format. In their desire to make it all things to all men, the creators of DVD have unfortunately had to make it so loose that, even now, we still have teething troubles with the format

I, personally don't know what you are talking about. I have owned my Sony player for almost 2 years, and there's never been a DVD that didn't play on it. Unless some moron put maple syrup on the disk before I had it (that happened). I heard all about lip-sync problems with my player (after I bought it) I noticed it occur a few times, but it hasn't happened in over a year. Web sites like "AudioReview.com" offer people an oppurtunity to read user reviews of products to determine if the product is a lemon or not. Additionally sites like these are quick to point out any serious problems with hardware (c.f. the recent Denon progressive player). A smart consumer can get a great DVD player with only a little research.

Futhermore, I don't see how its trying to be "all things to all men". It doesn't (yet) purport to replace your VCR, unless, like me, you don't record anything. I think its a better way to watch movies...and people who like to watch movies should at least check out a DVD player. I fail to see how it tries to be anything more than a better method to watch a movie than VHS or LD.

Originally posted by projectmolcos:
First off is the trend of re-releasing no-extras editions of things like BAD BOYS with bells-and-whistles issues some months later.

Yeah, the famous double release regret. It pisses everyone (except the studios) off. Its only a matter of time until it bites them in the ass. How many people are going to buy the bare boned edition of "put your favorite movie in here". My ball and chain and I love the movie "A Few Good Men" I almost bought it when I saw it earlier this year, but I just knew it was only a matter of time until they release the S.E. So I held off...I'm doin' the same thing with the Shawshank Redemption...and a few others. If you can't hold off you're only feeding the studio's reason for all the double releases.

Other than that I don't see too much to complain about, Kane and Gump are on the way, and apparently E1, although I have yet to hear anything official...I've been told to have a little faith...so I'll wait and see. I think DVD's in good shape.

[saraswati]

Originally posted by projectmolcos:
First up is the general looseness of the format. In their desire to make it all things to all men, the creators of DVD have unfortunately had to make it so loose that, even now, we still have teething troubles with the format – nearly four years after the fact. I agree that this has become less of a problem nowadays, and that most discs will play fine on most machines, but this just isn’t good enough, especially after four years after the fact. Four years and we still
have troubles? Not good enough! We shouldn't have had them to start with! I suppose some of us will say that that’s a problem which will recede in time. But, given the format is so loose, I would very much beg to differ, and say that remains to be seen. Who knows, as producers try more ambitious things with the discs, they may actually INCREASE.

i'm not really sure what you're talking about here. do you mean the lack of uniformity in general? for instance, varying case types, the persistant availability of pan&scan titles, varying formats, etc? or is this simply a prelude to your next point about malfunctions and disc compatibility?

Which neatly brings me to……..Disc compatibility (or lack thereof)... it’s incredulous that so many bought into a format where it still isn’t guaranteed that the software will play perfectly on the hardware when you get it home.

while i've heard of this kind of thing before, i've never experienced it. and from what i've heard, incompatibility mostly happens on DVD-rom and lesser quality stand alone players. which, actually, is consistent with previous technology when you compare the DVD format to the CD format and DVD-rom to the "bonus" audio CD-rom features. many cheap CD players (especially portables) have similar incompatibilities, and personally i have never got an audio CD to work in my CD-rom at home. also, i've noticed that different audio CD's will play differently on different players. put a disc that's in fairly good condition in one cd player, and it will skip and freeze as if you had left it under the cushions of your couch for 6 months. put it in a different player and it will sound fine. from what i understand, the "incompatibility" of dvd's is akin to this, which is unavoidable and inherent to the format. we can spend years trying to fix this, and we never will, because it is a fault inherent in the way cd players read cd's.

That said, the DVD incompatibilities must not be that big a deal, since, if it were happening to everyone all the time, the electronics companies and film studios wouldn't be making any money.

but I’m finding myself taking back an increasing number of plain ordinary discs to the shops for refunds, and that I’m not the only one doing this, not by a long shot. What’s happened to the quality control?

again, if this were a significant issue, and enough people were returning faulty discs or discs that were incompatible with their system, either the quality control situation would be addressed, or dvd would go out of business, because it simply wouldn't be profitable.

this couldn't be happening on such a large scale, or dvd would not have captured much of the mainstream market. while some of us dvd nerds who are junkies for better prints and original aspect ratios might have stuck it out, "mr. and mrs. joe average" would not. they would have gone right back to blockbuster.

I can see the studios sharpening their knives to kill it. First off is the trend of re-releasing no-extras editions of things like BAD BOYS with bells-and-whistles issues some months later.

i don't see this "killing" the dvd market. people who want to spend the money on a new version with an extra minute of footage will do that, and those who don't really care one way or the other will not. the more savvy consumers will wait a few months for word of a better edition, keep up on the "buzz" at the studios, etc. the less savvy people will spend more money than they should. this American ideal of stupidly flushing money down the toilet has been around much longer than DVD has. This is the same country that manufactures cars that must be replaced every 4 or 5 years, and computers that become obsolete every 2. It's also the same country that popularizes "collect 'em all" toys like beanie babies and pokemon. what, did you expect capitalism to stop for the advent of this wonderful new format?

also, all it takes to end this practice is to simply not buy the superfluous editions. the studios do this because they know it will make them money, plain and simple. if people don't buy the new editions, companies will stop making them. this is not a conspiracy to take down DVD, this is a way (a tried and tested way) to increase profits. which is why businesses exist. there really isn't anything new or especially insidious about it.

Now, I know that some will be glad to have these new editions, but I couldn’t disagree more.

fine. don't buy them. it's that simple.

By the way, anyone for rental windows? We’ve had them here for quite
some time and I’m given to understand that they’ll soon be making an appearance in America, thanks to Blockbuster Video.

actually, most of the major studios are against Blockbuster on this. it looks like we won't have rental pricing here in the states for a while, because the only company that seems to be championing it is Blockbuster.

And, if an enthusiast like me is saying all this, then what will Mr. and Mrs. Joe Average make of DVD? They might just decide they’re better off sticking with VHS and, if this happens, we can kiss the format’s long-term future goodbye.

actually, that's the last thing we have to worry about. "mr. and mrs. joe average" tend to spend their money blindly on whatever the latest trend happens to be. look at other current commercial trends and their effect on the average consumer's pocketbook. does the lack of cost-effectiveness prevent americans from buying SUV's? on the contrary; not only are the cars themselves expensive, but they get awful gas mileage, which you'd think people would be concerned with considering the looming energy crisis in this country. what about clothing? these days americans will spend an obscene amount of money on clothes that are meant to look used and abused. if mr. and mrs. joe average will buy designer distressed jeans and expensive faded and ripped t-shirts, what's to prevent them spending money on an unreliable and not-cost-effective video format? americans will buy anything if it's trendy, if it's the new thing to have. and DVD is the new thing to have right now, so americans are going to buy into it in large numbers regardless of faults.

in fact, the problem is not with a discriminating mainstream, it's with a widely un-descriminating mainstream. personally, my biggest fear about dvd becoming common is that the mainstream consumers won't care about quality. they won't care about good prints, original aspect ratios, and insightful extras. and while we won't literally be using VHS anymore, we will have a product of the same quality because the average consumer is not discriminating enough to care.

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"Crap, lousy ceiling!"

[Drexl]

Bugginess doesn't stop people from using one of the Windows operating systems.

[Eye]

Great topic and some interesting thoughts.

Since this topic deals more with the future of DVD from the subjective, personal viewpoint of projectmolcos and doesn't deal with specific DVD titles, I'll move this over to the SoapBox forum.

Join the discussion there.

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..:: Eye | Moderator | eye@dvdfile.com

[Templar]

Originally posted by saraswati:
...they won't care about good prints, original aspect ratios, and insightful extras. and while we won't literally be using VHS anymore, we will have a product of the same quality because the average consumer is not discriminating enough to care.

I used to fear this too, but recently I've had a slight change of heart. When shopping at our local Target on the weekend, I always look at the DVD collection and see what's new etc. I've noticed over the past few months that the fullscreen "Jurassic Park"s and "Lost World"s haven't budged. there's still like 6 in every bin. Can't be sure they're the same, but the slot for the widescreen versions are always empty or has one or two left. I think studios would be insane to boot the anamorphic standard now...especially since HD TV's are starting to come down in price...however slightly.

[tomdkat]

Even though I don't think DVDs future is gloomy, I DO most certainly understand EVERYTHING that projectmolcos states in his post.

DVD technology is just NOT at the point where I can go buy a DVD player, plug it in, turn it on, put in a DVD and watch it. If I get a cheap DVD player, any given DVD might not play. I should NOT have to become a DVD hardware expert in order to figure out what player to get because I did NOT have to become a VCR/VCP expert in order to go buy a VCR/VCP.

Right now, a lot of people don't care about surround sound or anamorphic widescreen or many of the other really great features of DVD. They want to watch their favorite movies and just enjoy them. Slowly, people will start to get more into Home Theater (and a LOT have) but it will take time before the average joe becomes savvy or the technology becomes easier to use.

My Aunt and Uncle bought a DVD player last X-Mas. My Aunt called me for recommendations. I recommended the Pioneer DV-333 as a good entry level player for them to get their feet wet. They ended up getting a Hitachi (don't know the model) because it had "more stuff". Now these are people who don't know what Dolby Digital 5.1 means, what dts means, what anamorphic means or any of that and they were sold a unit that may or may not be a good unit for them. SO far the unit has worked out very well for them, but if they had brought it home and set it up and their first DVD did not play, that would leave a bad taste in their mouth about DVD and would probably not invest any more time or money into the format.

Another friend went out and bought a DVD player from Circuit City (I forget the model, but it might have been a Zenith or something along those lines) and Casino. He brought the player home, set it up, popped in Casino and it would not play. He got mad, took the player back and exchanged it for a display model Toshiba 5109. He did not know what progressive scan was at the time and I'm not sure he knows what it is today. The salesguy told him the 5109 was a good player and he got a GREAT deal on it, since it was a display model. He brought that home and it played Casino just fine. Another friend of ours then got an Onkyo DVD player and a copy of Casino. His copy would not play in his DVD player. He called the first friend (the 5109 guy) and talked with him about Casino. The 5109 guy said "well the sales guy said some DVDs just don't play in some players. That's just the way it is...." It turned out, the particular copy of Casino the Onkyo friend had was problematic for his player and we exchanged DVDs and MY copy played fine in his player and HIS copy played fine in my Pioneer DVL-919. Onkyo friend was bummed out because he spent ALL this money on hardware only to find his FAVORITE movie would not play (until he got my copy).

You can argue all day and night that he should have done his homework and learned more about DVD hardware/software before making his purchase, but the average person isn't going to necessarily think that way. When was the last time you did exhaustive research on which $50 VCR to buy? Or do you just go pick one up and expect basic playback of videos?

Of course, I'm assuming ANY given DVD player one buys will not be defective. Defective VCRs are just as bad as defective DVD players so we won't count hardware problems in this discussion.

I'm still surprised that DVD technology has not IN THIS DAY become as easy to use as VHS.

DVD technology is capable of doing some REALLY great things and I'm a FIRM supporter of DVD technology and when my friends talk about DVD and Home Theater I try to talk with them BEFORE they spend money to make sure they spend their money wisely.

The problem is, the guy who wants to buy the $60 VCR and expect it play his favorite VHS video is the same guy who wants to buy the $100 DVD player (basic unit) and expect it to play ANY DVD the same way his $60 VCR will play ANY VHS video. Again, if the DVD is all jacked up, that is the same as a VHS video being all mangled (for this discussion).

*BOTH* of my Casino friends had problems with BRAND NEW copies of Casino on their BRAND NEW DVD players...... I don't think that is good......

Newer entry level DVD players are VERY good at playing virtually ANY DVD you throw at it. I give my friends and family members entry level DVD players are gifts to help them get exposed to DVD technology (since it's 'hot' right now to have a DVD player) and to give them a chance to learn more about DVD technology BEFORE they decide to spend money. I tell them "this is your FIRST DVD player, but it won't be your last".

Wow, my hands are cramped!!!!!

Peace....

[saraswati]

in reply to tomdkat --

true. but this is the same for any consumer product. here's an example. shoes. i'm using shoes because i know about shoes, and because they're a fairly common consumer product that we all have experience with.

i would consider myself a shoe conniseur, if there is such a thing. i know how shoes are made, who the top designers are, how much i should pay for a decent pair, what the current styles are, etc.

when i buy shoes, i like to get my money's worth. before i even walk into a shoe store, i like to know a few things first. #1 -- what kind of shoes am i shopping for? am i going to come home with a new pair of black leather boots i'll wear to work everyday, or a pair of kiwi-green platform flipflops that i'll only wear on weekends, when i happen to be wearing something that matches them?
#2 -- how much money do i want to spend? this question is pretty self explanatory.
#3 -- what kind of quality am i looking for? is this a quickie purchase because i'm a girl and i'm pms-ing and NOTHING looks good with this skirt!?!? or is this an investment, a pair of shoes i'll wear for years?

so i walk into the store, considering these questions. and i look around and i pick something i like. i check the price tag -- how much is this gonna cost me? i look really closely at the shoe -- is it well designed? does it look cheap? is the leather obviously fake? is it going to give me blisters or be hard to walk in? next i try the shoe on. does it feel good? does it go with at least 2 articles of clothing i already own? does it mesh with my personal style? will i wear this a lot?

finally, i put all these variables and questions together. if the leather looks fake, are the shoes cheap enough to where it doesn't really matter? if these shoes are going to give me blisters, am i going to break them in eventually or are they going to gather dust because of the constant pain?

after evaluating my choices, comparing them with other similar styles, etc. i make my decision. do i buy the shoes or not?


i hope you can see the comparison i'm trying to make. people who are sensible shoppers evaluate what they are buying and make decisions before they pull out their checkbook. some people don't do this well. they end up with cheap-looking Payless crap that's going to fall apart within a month, probably while they're on your feet. This is the same as the people you try to help who go out and buy bottom-of-the-line equipment.

You get what you pay for. if you're buying a no-name-brand, especially in electronics, you're probably not getting the deal you think you are. and people who aren't intelligent enough to understand this deserve to be out $100 or so for a DVD player that won't play 100% of discs.

You shouldn't have to be an electronics expert to shop intelligently, but you should know your way around the equipment. most people i know who are going to spend money on some new thing they don't really know about take the time to read up on whatever they're buying before they hand over their credit card. No one walks into a car dealership, says, "give me the cheapest thing you have!" signs the papers, and drives away only to find out the car has no options, gets terrible gas mileage, drives like crap, and needs work already, on top of having no warranty.

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"Crap, lousy ceiling!"

[tomdkat]

reply to saraswati:

Yes, I understand your shoe analogy and it applies very well. The difference being chances a VERY good that the Payless shoes I buy without question will fit if I get the right size. If someone goes out and buys a DVD-Video player (assuming they know enough to ask for DVD-Video like I know enough to know my show size), are the chances really that great that it will play any given DVD?

I also think that the cost of the product has a BIG impact on the amount of research people do. If ALL DVD players were $1,000 and up, people would do MUCH more research.

If cars cost as little as $100 NEW, I'm sure I wouldn't care about the bad gas mileage as long as the car ran WHENEVER I needed it to run.

Now, if that $100 car didn't run when I needed it to run, I would be pissed off.

Eye recently reported a problem where the Special Edition of T2 (DVD-09) does NOT play correctly in his Pioneer DV-37. The DV-37 is a respectable DVD player and nothing to sneeze at. The machine retails for about $1,000 but you can find them for about half that (roughly) now. Should Eye be able to expect this player to play ANY given DVD correctly? This is the first time I've EVER heard of this kind of problem and if it were prevalent I'm sure we would have heard of it by now.

So, Eye is miffed and is ready to chuck his T2 DVD..... At this stage of the game, is it reasonable for him to think T2 would play ok in his good/great DVD player?

I guess the big problem I have with DVD technology is it's not at the point where I can just play the DVDs and not worry about problems, the way I used to play VHS videos.

Again, I'm a FIRM supporter of DVD technology and I certainly hope the DVD manufacturers pay attention to public concerns about stuff like this and take measures to make better DVD players and better DVDs.

Personally, I think this is a VERY exciting time for DVD, LD, and Home Theater in general and I consider myself lucky to be part of the "movement", by participating in great forums, such as DVD File, and by helping to educate those that I can.

I am NOT a DVD God, by any means, but I can help people get a basic understanding of some of the DVD buzz-terms to help them make intelligent decisions about what hardware yo buy.

I also like having the opportunity to discuss issues like this with others whom I can learn a lot from......



Peace.....

[clortho]

Well, I think most of the problems lay squarely at the feet of the hardware manufacturers. Bad pressings happen, and even in cd replication still occur, but it is relatively small percentage-wise. The thing is, especially early on, hardware manufacturers had the complete DVD spec layed out before them and then did things like "Oh, we don't need that much memory," or "Oh, they'll never use multi-angle or seamless branching," and screwed up. A fair amount of manufacturers owned up to those mistakes in the form of firmware upgrades, but unfortunately some did not and some are still putting out sub-par product. Should the studios make sure their disks run fine on every player if they follow the laid out DVD spec? Certainly not--it's really not possible given the multitude of players out there now. Should every hardware manufacturer adhere to the spec so things like this don't happen? Absolutely.

That's my take on it, anyhow.

Clortho

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I am the Keymaster
clortho@hotmail.com

[This message has been edited by clortho (edited 05-21-2001).]

[tomdkat]

Originally posted by clortho:
Well, I think most of the problems lay squarely at the feet of the hardware manufacturers. Bad pressings happen, and even in cd replication still occur, but it is relatively small percentage-wise. The thing is, especially early on, hardware manufacturers had the complete DVD spec layed out before them and then did things like "Oh, we don't need that much memory," or "Oh, they'll never use multi-angle or seamless branching," and screwed up. A fair amount of manufacturers owned up to those mistakes in the form of firmware upgrades, but unfortunately some did not and some are still putting out sub-par product. Should the studios make sure their disks run fine on every player if they follow the laid out DVD spec? Certainly not--it's really not possible given the multitude of players out there now. Should every hardware manufacturer adhere to the spec so things like this don't happen? Absolutely.


That's my take on it, anyhow.


Clortho

Great point!

Peace....

[manigrasso]

With all due respect to saraswati, maybe this is a better analogy...

Aside from my 2 dvd players, I own 4 VCRs. One of them, a Hitachi, can NOT play a tape recorded in SLP. It's not such a big deal for me, since I really don't watch SLP anymore, but for people who collect years of their soap opera "stories on SLP tape, you can bet they would've been pissed had they bought that player.

Also, any tape I record in that VCR sounds fine in THAT vcr, but shitty in any of my others. No tracking adjustment helps, at all.

I have a sister with a Zenith with the same problem, and she has some more stuff on SLP VHS than I do, and she was very unhappy. Now, VHS is not my format of choice, but the problem with that Hitachi, and my sister's problem with her Zenith, isn't swearing us off the format. It's just one of those things. Some people might take that as kind of a problem "DVD sucks, I bought one that won't play Casino,"-but those are the kind of people who would swear off ANYTHING if the first one they bought doesn't work. They'd swear off toast if their first toaster was a lemon. It's the nature of the consumer beast.

[1138]

Originally posted by clortho:
That's my take on it, anyhow.

Well, to be fair to the hardware guys, I think part of the problem is that they had no real software to thoroughly test this stuff out. Sure, they probably had test discs, but those can only do so much.

And if we're going to lay out the blame too, some should go to the software makers too. Didn't they do any testing on some of these discs? Disney for instance: with so many reported problems with many different brands of players (many being name brands), di dthey not see this coming? Sure, it migh be some hardware faultiness, but you develop for what's out there. Maybe they should hold back on some of the complicated stuff until more players can handle it correctly.

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1138 - DVD File Forum Greeter
I've been trying to figure something in my head, and maybe you can help me out, yeah? When a person is insane, as you clearly are, do you know that you're insane? Maybe you're just sitting around, reading "Guns and Ammo", masturbating in your own feces, do you just stop and go, "Wow! It is amazing how fucking crazy I really am!"? Yeah. Do you guys do that?

[Taxi]

People have been mourning the death of DVD since the beginning. I don't see it happening, folks.



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Taxi - DVDFile Forum Administrator
Eleven plus two = Twelve plus one

[Fart Lighter]

just want to point something out from my pOV: A DVD player is just that. Cheaper models do not state 'PLAYS SELECTED DVDS' on them, they say 'DVD PLAYER' and as such should be expected to play everything. No excuses. They should do the job correctly, or not do it at all. It's not just cheaper machines that have compatibility problmes here either, so lets dispell that myth. A lot of probelms are down to the studio's disk pressings. PATHE here int he UK produce great quality DVDs, but they're notorius for not working correctly on most players. Can you really blame a machine when 80% of models won't play the CURSE OF THE BLAIR WITCH doc? No. It's the disk. Something should be done to stamp out compatibilty problems.
I've a DVD-rOM, and have had less trouble with it than any of my friends have with stand-alone macines, so the DVD-ROM issue is wrong.

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Sniff that!

[Joe Michaels]

Predicting the doom of DVD? I could understand this a year or two ago but not now. Like someone said there are 17 million players, and I don't know if that includes DVD Rom on PC. Of course people don't use their PC to watch movies but it does show that DVD is the next format to go with.
You're also leaving out that every game console manufaturer is going with DVD as it's format of choice. 3 million DVD enabled Playstation 2's in the U.S. alone. by Christmas there will be 5 million and a million XBOX's will carry DVD capability as well.
There are those mainstreamers that will not accept DVD until the bitter end but most people know DVD is cool and want one.
Even Video financial projections have manufacturers spending more to produce DVDs than videos in the next 5 years.
Also look at stores like Best Buy. They have dedicated their whole video section to DVD because it has been so profitable for them. Save one aisle for Tapes. And Blockbuster is on board as you mentioned.
Also, How many stores give away DVD players with the purchase of a TV? I see one of these sales in the paper on a weekly basis.
As for DVD's being incompatible and killing the format, If tape eating players and dirty video head couldn't kill VHS, why would a couple of unplayable discs kill DVD?
The mainstream has already accepted DVD in a big way with open arms. To proclaim DVD has nails in it's coffin because of a couple of flaws seems crazy to me. Show me a format and I'll show you a flaw.

[Templar]

Originally posted by Joe Michaels:
Predicting the doom of DVD? I could understand this a year or two ago but not now. Like someone said there are 17 million players, and I don't know if that includes DVD Rom on PC.

17 Million does NOT include PC players.

[Brad Vautrinot]

I'm using two DVD players - Sony 7000 and Sony 7700 - as a few discs won't play on one, but will on the other and vice-versa.

I feel that the biggest screw-up with DVD's was in the beginning when no STANDARDS were mandated or adopted by both hardware and software manufacturers. There still aren't any, to the best of my knowledge.

[darthmaulclone]

I live down here in Australia.

I have a pioneer drive at home on my computer and have had it for almost 2 years now. Apart from some software related problems I had when I first got the drive. It has been one of the best purchases I made and I am very happy to have moved into the world of dvd. In the time since I got the player I have bought about 40 titles which is lot for me since in the 14 years I have had a vcr I have bought about 4 or 5 movies on tape.

DVD has changed our expectations in many areas not least of which being extras. In the early days (for me) I was happy when discs had the movie a few trailers and maybe one or 2 other things. The Matrix was released and the extras made available just blew me away.

DVD is an evolving format and thankfully there has not been a problem to the level of VHS with conflicting formats.

THough it is heading that way with recordable discs.

DVD while problematic at times has been one of the best pruchases I have made and there are no regrets. I now have a standalone player and make full use of it to play both region 1 and 4 discs and have had no problems yet with compatability.

The only thing I am worried about is that most of the new US releases is the REC protection as I am not sure if such protected discs will work on my machine.

So heres hoping I have no problems.