Rebuilding HT!

[brttlt]

I'm starting over piece by piece. As most of you know I have a Panny HTIB...but it's time to move up! Where did you guys start? Receiver, speakers, sub...?
Thanks

[I 8 Piglet]

I think the general consensus (sp?) around here is that will notice the biggest improvement buy upgrading your speakers first. Than I would do the reciever and last, the sub. Thats MHO at least.

[RedBaronF2001]

Here's my formula for a "kick butt" HT ("street" prices given):

Infocus Screenplay 4800 DLP projector > $999
Da-Lite High Contrast 96" Screen > $299
Totem Acoustic Dreamcatcher 5.1 speaker system > $1599
Denon AVR-2803 7.1 DD/DTS/DPLIIx receiver > $599
Denon DVD-2200 DVD player (SACD & DVD-A) > $549
Cables/Interconnects > $199
Projector Mount (to ceiling) > $99

Total ~$4400

I recently installed this very system and was blown away. All this kit for under 5K and with a 96" screen to boot! The Totem system is simply amazing for this pricepoint.

[chlngr1970]

sounds like a Plan. I think my advise would be to be get the speakers first, then the receiver, then the display, followed by the DVD player. Cables as needed with the gear.

Hope this helps...

j

[I 8 Piglet]

Originally Posted by RedBaronF2001

Here's my formula for a "kick butt" HT ("street" prices given):

Infocus Screenplay 4800 DLP projector > $999
Da-Lite High Contrast 96" Screen > $299
Totem Acoustic Dreamcatcher 5.1 speaker system > $1599
Denon AVR-2803 7.1 DD/DTS/DPLIIx receiver > $599
Denon DVD-2200 DVD player (SACD & DVD-A) > $549
Cables/Interconnects > $199
Projector Mount (to ceiling) > $99

Total ~$4400

I recently installed this very system and was blown away. All this kit for under 5K and with a 96" screen to boot! The Totem system is simply amazing for this pricepoint.

Just to knit pick a little...
-Why waste the money on the SP4800...when the x1 is the same thing for $300 less?
-Do you mean a 16:9 96" screen? because I couldnt find one for less than $450...hook me up with your retailer , But either way, there are some very good, very cheap DIY alternatives that can keep your budget way down.
-I like Totems a lot, but I thought the dreamcatchers left a little to be desired. They are fine for a very small space, but I didnt think they did to well in a normal sized room...plus I think that sub is horrible, with speakers of that size you really need a substantial sub, and it seemed to me as if they looked to the sub as a place to save money. I also didnt find them to be too musical. I love Totems, dont me wrong, I just think that the dreamcatchers are a little too small for their own good.
-Assuming you are not MrKelling , it seems a little silly to spend more than half the price of your display on your DVD player. Especially with DVDa/ SACD options like the DV563a out there for less than $200 bucks. And even if your main overarching concern is the DVDa/ SACD I would think you would want more musical speakers.
-I think you may have underestimated your interconnects when you condiser that a decent cable with the length to run to your ceiling mounted PJ is gonna cost 1/4 -1/2 your budget and your probably gonna want two (that projector cant handle interlaced and progressive signals via the same input)
-My ceiling mount cost $10 in lexan, and I already had the screws...So you can save money there.

All in all I think you've put together a decent system. The changes I would make would be to swap the speakers with Axioms, and since I already have an x1 (which I love) I would opt for a step up, either the Sony HS20 (LCD), or the NEC HT1100 (DLP), which would of course, bump the budget up to around $6500.

[RedBaronF2001]

Originally Posted by I 8 Piglet

Just to knit pick a little...
-Why waste the money on the SP4800...when the x1 is the same thing for $300 less?

The 4800 can be found for the same price if you look hard enough. I happened to find one for $999 online. The Gamma settings on the 4800 out of the box looked better to me than the X1. You could easily subsitute this for an X1 or X2 these days.

-Do you mean a 16:9 96" screen? because I couldnt find one for less than $450...hook me up with your retailer , But either way, there are some very good, very cheap DIY alternatives that can keep your budget way down.

Yes. Da-Lite will sell you the plain screen material sans frame for less money. I built a false wall and built the screen into the wall and framed it in wood (with black felt around the perimeter). It turned out very nice. Very high "WAF" factor.

-I like Totems a lot, but I thought the dreamcatchers left a little to be desired. They are fine for a very small space, but I didnt think they did to well in a normal sized room...plus I think that sub is horrible, with speakers of that size you really need a substantial sub, and it seemed to me as if they looked to the sub as a place to save money. I also didnt find them to be too musical. I love Totems, dont me wrong, I just think that the dreamcatchers are a little too small for their own good.

Don't take this the wrong way, but have you actually sat down and listened to these? For the money (emphasis here), they are the most musical (keyword) little speakers for the money. Yes, you can buy larger and louder speakers. These, however, image like no other in this range. Yes, the subwoofer may seem weak for some. The customers I built this for didn't want or need to rattle their teeth. The sub dives down low, and keeps it clean. Plus, this little system comes in a variety of finishes and has a real high "WAF" factor.

-Assuming you are not MrKelling , it seems a little silly to spend more than half the price of your display on your DVD player. Especially with DVDa/ SACD options like the DV563a out there for less than $200 bucks. And even if your main overarching concern is the DVDa/ SACD I would think you would want more musical speakers.

Emphasis here again on musicality. The DACs in the Denon are superior to the DACs in the Pioneer. It's not just about getting the features you want (you can get a $35 progressive scan DVD player these days), but how they are executed. The Denon also uses a superior de-interlacing chipset (DVDO). Fed to the VGA-in on the 4800 these setup looks good!

-I think you may have underestimated your interconnects when you condiser that a decent cable with the length to run to your ceiling mounted PJ is gonna cost 1/4 -1/2 your budget and your probably gonna want two (that projector cant handle interlaced and progressive signals via the same input)

Given that the projector was mounted in a bookshelf on the rear wall along with the components, long interconnects were not a problem. We used a spool of 12AWG UL certified speaker wire (in-wall certified) $49, one set of component cables (Monster THX, $19.99 - fine for the money), one coaxial digital cable (Monster THX again, $13.99), 3 pair of analog audio interconnects (Monster THX, $12.99/each), and finally a 16FT Monster THX sub cable ($19.99). I merely estimated the $199 - YMMV.

-My ceiling mount cost $10 in lexan, and I already had the screws...So you can save money there.

True, this particular one was mounted in a bookcase on the back wall. I put this in so there were no surprises.

All in all I think you've put together a decent system. The changes I would make would be to swap the speakers with Axioms, and since I already have an x1 (which I love) I would opt for a step up, either the Sony HS20 (LCD), or the NEC HT1100 (DLP), which would of course, bump the budget up to around $6500.

These particular customers were blown away. All the wires were hidden, the components were hidden, the screen "blended" in. Very high WAF (Wife Acceptance Factor) on this setup. Can one do better, absolutely, but for this kind of money - this setup is incredible.

[I 8 Piglet]

Originally Posted by RedBaronF2001

The 4800 can be found for the same price if you look hard enough. I happened to find one for $999 online. The Gamma settings on the 4800 out of the box looked better to me than the X1. You could easily subsitute this for an X1 or X2 these days.

I would be carefull substituting the x2 for anything, it may have 400 more lumens, but your giving up the farudja. I havent seen the 4800 for Less than $999 (like you say), but you can easily find the x1 for $700, less if you really try.

Originally Posted by RedBaronF2001

Don't take this the wrong way, but have you actually sat down and listened to these? For the money (emphasis here), they are the most musical (keyword) little speakers for the money. Yes, you can buy larger and louder speakers. These, however, image like no other in this range. Yes, the subwoofer may seem weak for some. The customers I built this for didn't want or need to rattle their teeth. The sub dives down low, and keeps it clean. Plus, this little system comes in a variety of finishes and has a real high "WAF" factor.

I have listened to the totems. On several occasions actually. Once for several hours. I agree with the WAF. My fiancee was ready to go home with them right away. I really just disagree, I dont think they are musical at all (although to be fair I didnt listen to any SACDs or DVDa). Sure they are good for their size...but than again so are the bose. And I found the sub to be anything but clean, it sounded very boomy, and it ratteled like something that came in a BestBuy HTiB. I came very close to walking out of the store with a pair of the Arro's though. I thought those were beautiful little speakers. But the distintion between the two lines was night and day. I know audio files tell you you cant get quality sound with out a substantial speaker cabinat, I dont know how true that is, but the differnce between the Arros and the dreamcatchers (which correct me if Im wrong but are the same drivers in larger cabinat) is just too huge. IMHO

Originally Posted by RedBaronF2001

Emphasis here again on musicality. The DACs in the Denon are superior to the DACs in the Pioneer. It's not just about getting the features you want (you can get a $35 progressive scan DVD player these days), but how they are executed. The Denon also uses a superior de-interlacing chipset (DVDO). Fed to the VGA-in on the 4800 these setup looks good!

I wasnt argueing against the Denon, its a great machine, if I had the cash thats where I would put it too. It just struck me as odd, that you go for a bottom end display, and IMO less musical speakers, and mate them with a high end DVD player, that is as well reguarded for its audio cababiltiy as well as its video.

[RedBaronF2001]

All I had to read was the comparison of Totem to Bose. I won't bother on this one. Calling the Totem's "not musical" is blasphemy!

And yes, with the introduction of the 4805, you can find the 4800 for $999 easily. Even Sam's Club carries the 4800 (w/ screen for $1199).

As for the Denon DVD player - most people concentrate on buying $$$ speakers and skimp on the sources. I once saw an audio shop try to sell B&W Nautilus 802s hooked up to a low-end Yamaha receiver and CD player. Come on!

Totems are sensitive to a good signal and the Denons upstream will feed them just that. You must have listened to the Totems with cheap equipment. Yes, they are using identical drivers as the Arro. The larger cabinet of the Arro allows for deeper bass extension. Imaging is almost identical.

I'll start recommending to clients a better display once they request it. With the introduction of the xHD3 HD2+ chips, the HD2-equipped PJs will inevitably come down in price.

[I 8 Piglet]

Dude read my post if you are going to respond to it. What I said was that you can find the 4800 for $999, but you can find the x1 for $700.

The totems I listened to were being fed by an Arcam reciever, I dont know which model, but it was selling it for $1200. I remember this, because I thaught it was a little shady, demoing speakers with a reciever that costs nearly as much as the entire 5.1 set. Especially when I new that I wouldnt be using a reciever that costs much more than half that.

Please dont misunderstand, I am a big fan of totems I love their speakers I just dont think the dreamcatcher system is worth the money. I dont mean to imply that $1500 is a lot to spend on speakers by any means, but I think it could be better spent.

[snipsnapsappy]

I am willing to bet this would kill that Totem setup for the same price. I own this, only with the larger center speaker and a different sub. I have yet to hear a speaker I like more in a store or in a home than my M22's.

http://www.axiomaudio.com/epicgrandmaster.html

I however, agree with the Denon picks, Only, I think that he would be fine with the Denon 1804, his room is not that big.

He already has a nice TV and the Pioneer 563A. So all he needs is speakers, reciever, and a good sub.