Tombstone - VISTA Series

[Adjuster]

I watched this last night and I forgot how awesome this movie is. It's filled with great quotes and IMO, Val Kilmer's best performance to date.

This one truly deserves a spot as one of the best westerns of all time.

About the disc:

I don't have a reference system so I didn't notice the out of control edge enhancement that everyone is talking about. The picture looked just great on my little POS system.

The sound was very good, although I never heard the previous DVD.

The one thing I am dissapointed in is the supplements. They left me wanting more. The featurettes are pretty interesting but they only last about a half hour. I really wanted to learn more about the true history of the characters.

It seems for a 2-disc set, they should have worked on some more stuff. This release is a lot like the VISTA series of Unbreakable. There isn't enough supplemental material to warrant an extra disc.

I guess I am just spoiled, but I would have liked this to be more like the T2, Fight Club, Se7en, Episode I, and all the disney CE two disc sets.

There's still material on those that I haven't gone through yet. I went through all the materials on the tombstone disc in about an hour.

Still, it's worth getting because the movie kicks such major ass.

Anyone else feel the same?

[tomdkat]

I have NOT watched my copy of Tombstone (Vista) yet and I'm not looking forward to the edge enhancement horror that awaits me.

For those without HD displays, you can see just how bad the EE is here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...9&pagenumber=3

It's about as bad as Star Wars Episode I, if not worse, as indicated in the DVD File review of this DVD...



Peace......

[SeanL]

You know, I guess I get too wrapped up in the movie, because I never notice the edge enhancement. I just don't pay attention to it.

[The Riddler]

I just picked up mine TODAY! Might watch it tonight! I forgot a lot of the details of the film & I never bought the original release (thank God!) so hopefully it'll be an enjoyable experience!

[Fezzik]

I never tend to notice EE. I have a 27" Trinitron with anamorphic squeeze, and to notice it on a disc (Episode 1 being a prime example) I literally have to pause it and have someone point it out to me. People have to realize, more and more, that the largest majority of DVD buyers don't have the kind of equipment that will even pick this sort of thing up, atleast not pick it up to a noticeable degree. I know my TV is far from high end, but I love the picture quality. It may not be a top of the line HDTV, but it's not some Sanyo turd from Wal-Mart either.

[tomdkat]

Originally posted by Fezzik
I never tend to notice EE. I have a 27" Trinitron with anamorphic squeeze, and to notice it on a disc (Episode 1 being a prime example) I literally have to pause it and have someone point it out to me. People have to realize, more and more, that the largest majority of DVD buyers don't have the kind of equipment that will even pick this sort of thing up, atleast not pick it up to a noticeabel degree. I know my TV is far from high end, but I love the picture quality. It may not be a top of the line HDTV, but it's not some Sanyo turd from Wal-Mart either.

You make some really valid points, Fezzik. I guess one of the reasons why people make such a big deal is we ALL watch the same DVDs as they are produced, regardless of the equipment you have. So those with the really fancy high-end gear end up watching flawed video transfers that those without the fancy hardware don't really notice and those with the high-end hardware don't feel that is really 'right'.

DVDs can be authored to have the best video and audio transfer the format can support and EVERYONE benefits. The people with 'low-end' hardware can admire the beautiful video as well as those with high-end video. Why should I have to watch flawed video because I have higher-end video display equipment?

Maybe this is where 'special' releases, like Superbit, come into play because they can focus on the absolute BEST video and audio they can produce for the high-end consumer. Ultimately, the high-end folks would want 2-disc Superbit-like releases where disc 1 had the non-EE high-def video and audio transfers and the special features on disc 2.

Of course, these SAME DVDs could be enjoyed by those without the high-end hardware as well. This is the part that baffles me. Why NOT author the DVD video to appear as best as possible on high-end displays (not talking aspect ratio guys) and let the lower-end displays benefit from that effort as well?

People advise that anamorphic widescreen DVDs should be authored and purchased (vs non-anamorphic) because they will be able to support high-end displays whenever the consumer decides to 'upgrade' vs having to invest in further technology to account for the fact the DVD was authored a certain way (non-anamorphic or whatever).

I just don't understand why this issue even exists because it is definitely in the control of those who make the DVDs. I wonder what the DVD authors think of the EE after they make the DVD video. I'm sure tey have the highest-end hardware.....

Hmmm........

Peace......

[SolidSnakeASS]

Bjoern Roy is one crazy motha.

[Dehrian]

I picked it up today. Just watched it for the first time since it's theatrical release...

Why do people like this movie so much? Trying figure it out. Starts well, but the pacing is all screwed up.

[1138]

What tom said. If it doesn't benefit smaller TV people, so why bother putting it in there?

[Batnight]

Someone please tell me what edge enhancement is!

[Prancer]

Batnight,

I wasn't quite sure what that term was but after checking out the images by tomdkat(above) I understand what the term means. I hope it helps.

[Batnight]

Everytime I click on the link this comes up it says the page is unavailable.

[tomdkat]

Guys, check out Bjoern Roy's site to learn about Edge Enhancement, see DVD vs LD audio comparisons, and to see Superbit comparisons:

http://home.t-online.de/home/bjoern....in/Page_01.htm

Enjoy!



Peace.....

[tomdkat]

Originally posted by Batnight
Everytime I click on the link this comes up it says the page is unavailable.

The AVS Forum thread was removed by the original poster because he was getting flamed by all kinds of people, including me to a degree.

He was basically complaining about the TONS of edge enhancement used in Tombstone and was criticizing THX for certifying such a bad video transfer. I had no problem with that, but I *did* have a problem with his blatant "THX=POS" statement, which on the surface implies that ANYTHING that is THX certifiied is crap, which I don't necessarily think is true (Fight Club being just ONE example of many).

So, we had a brief THX discussion on his Tombstone thread and that was the extent to MY 'flaming' of him in that thread.

Others were attacking him on a more personal level (name calling, etc) so he nuked the thread.

Unfortunately, the Tombstone shots are not on Bjoern Roy's main Edge Enhancement page, but I'm sure he will post those pics there at some point.

Nonetheless, the edge enhancement (EE) that he demonstrates in Star Wars Episode I *ALSO* appears in Tombstone and just as badly. The DVD File review of Tombstone (Vista) also indicated overuse of EE.

Peace.....

[Prancer]

Thanks tomdkat,

I just read the 'report' by Bjoern Roy and he gives a very clear, no pun intended but great that it happened, picture of what EE is.

I used to see this problem all the time while doing Graphic Design work. I've over used the 'sharpen' feature on certain programs and will see the halos. IT looks horrible but most people did not notice things like that.


I am still waiting on buying Tomstone just because I don't know if I would like the film. AFter looking at the package design at Suncoast Video, I almost bought it blindly but decided not to. Still looking forward to watching this film maybe I'll rent it this weekend or maybe find someone I know who has bought it.

[THXHEYNOW]

I basically learned what edge enhancement after watching this disc. Wow. I thought the focus on my set got alls screwed up or something for certain shots.

[fuser]

Why don't you start a petition against edge enhancement at petitiononline.com, I'd sign it right away!

[smurdleman2000]

I like the Tombstone and all, and am enjoying the DVD, but what would really tickle me colored pink is a DVD for Wyatt Earp, the extended version of course. Anyone have any knews about that?

[Bjoern Roy]

That thread on the AVS were i posted the pics got indeed deleted.

For those interested, this was the post:

___________
Some folks were hoping that its not as bad as Unbreakable. Eh, well...

Here are some crops for reference (scale factor identical for all):

Fast and the Furious: no EE


Unbreakable: quite a bit of EE, both hEE and vEE


Star Wars TPM: strong EE, especially vEE (at horiz. edges)


Tomb Stone Vista: strong EE, especially hEE (at vert. edges)


Whether you guys will actually have a problem with the ringing depends on the quality of your setup, the distance from your screen, your pickyness and your general preference in picture attributes.

Its quite a nice transfer otherwise, so i think most TV and RPTV users here will be pleased. Don't expect it to get any applause from me, though.
______________

[Taxi]

Thanks for the screen shots, Bjoern!

[Heckalaska]

Ahhh, it's times like this when I'm almost glad I can't afford a high-end system! I bet it really pisses off you guys who drop thousands on your system, huh? hahahahaha!

For once, being dirt-poor is an advantage!

[pilauh]

even if you have a standard but cool (yep !) widescreen (32 inch) and a good 5.1 system, you might want something bigger in a near future.... so what about your collection full of EE (h & v) ?

why don't we have the best treatment since the start ?

[Raf]

Has anyone compiled a list of DVDs which have a lot of EE? I own TPM, but I didn't notice the EE until I played it on my new RPTV. (It wasn't apparent on my standard tube 27 and 36 inchers...) It would be nice to steer clear of any which had questionable transfers...

-Raf

[MovieFan.Com]

One of my Favorite Westerns - - - -

[The Limey]

Seeing this thread has put me in the mood for another viewing of Tombstone.

One of my favorite Val Kilmer performances!