Continue the Fight Club discussion here (***Spoilers***)

[Taxi]

Have at it, folks.

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Taxi
DVDFile Forum Administrator

[P7A77]

Well, that's no fun. It's more exciting to let them spring up when and where they do.

[P7A77]

mani, I'm sorry if I came off as insulting... I didn't mean to be. I'm just not sure where it was said that these are two people and then *poof* suddenly one of them doesn't exist. I don't think that was ever said, and I don't think that's what the movie is saying. If that's what it *was* then I'd have to agree that it's a bit sloppy. I'm taking issue with what you see as being presented, not your interpreation of or reaction to it.

[SolidSnakeASS]

Great movie, easily in my top 5 movies of all time. And anyone who doesn't own the disc's or like it suck! That should start some discussion.

[manigrasso]

Yeah...that was a real nice friendly intelligent debate we had going on here. Thanks for fuc*ing it up, SolidSnakeASS. I'm sure glad I didn't say something like "Anyone who likes Fight Club is a retard," lest I wind up looking like a complete jackass too. Good work, Skippy.

P7A77,

Well, now I feel like I have to watch it again to make sure I'm not loopy, but wasn't there an "epiphany" scene, where Tyler spells out to Jack that he is a figment of Jack's imagination? Doesn't Tyler then say most of the things people were saying in our previous thread? (like nobody ever has a conversation with Tyler and Jack at the same time, it's either one or the other, when Tyler was schtupping Carter's character [forget her name], Jack had to distance himself from it by imagining himself in another room, stuff like that?) Isn't that why, after that scene, people refer to Jack as Tyler? Isn't that why, when Tyler is kicking Jack's ass, you can't see Tyler in the security cameras? And isn't that why Jack shoots himself in an attempt to stop Tyler?

I thought of one other scene that bugged me:

When Tyler and/or Jack are starting their militia, and there's one person waiting outside hoping to be let in. Tyler tells him to fuck off, then Jack immediately tells the guy to just stick it out. Which means that, in theory, this guy saw *Jack* tell him to fuck off, then *Jack* telling him to not fuck off. Am I remembering things wrong, or is that what happened? And if that's how it happened, yes, I would consider it sloppy.

This is John's rant...but you don't have to read it, because apparently, John sucks.

manigrasso



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Always remember to be nice to the dogs...when the revolution comes, they'll remember.

[1138]

Let's just stay on track with the topic at hand, insults aside.

Yes, the guy waiting had the same pseron yelling at him and helping him. But look at what these guys are doing to begin with: joining some terrorist/miltitia orginization. Their mind isn't fully funtioning at this point anyway. They'll do anything Tyler/narrator says. So they see his multiple personality traits as nothing to be worried about.

We end up seeing the main character as he sees himself. That's why you see both characters in a romm talking. That's what he thinks is going on. It's all in his mind. Sure, having this occur in the rest of the real world without it falling apart way earlier is rather small, but then again, it's just a fictional story.

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1138
Hardware forum moderator | DVDFile Forum Greeter
Floyd is pink. Lando is a sex machine.

[manigrasso]

Once again, I know, I know! I just don't feel it's a legitimate way to tell a story. Bottom line: If you like a story, or if you're inventing a story, you can rationalize any deficits there may be.

[SolidSnakeASS]

Manigrasshole if you want an intelligent conversation I'll bring 'it'. Yet when I post what is obviously a joke and is supposed to be taken with a grain of salt you don't need to ostrazize me for it.

I really don't understand why you can't grasp the fact that the movie is always from Jack's prespective and that's why we never see Tyler without him. And he says, "it's a change over, the movie keeps going and the audience is none the wiser," obviously meaning we don't see everything that happens. You should be glad since if we did see everything the movie would be at least twice as long as it is (personally I think that would own!).

[This message has been edited by SolidSnakeASS (edited 02-06-2001).]

[Kevin M]

On the other side of that coin Mani, if you hate a storyline or the way it unveils, you will refuse & ignore any reasonable explanation of that storyline or the way it unveils.

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-----Kevin M.-----
"Let's build a snowman! We can make him our best friend! We can name him paul or we can name him.....Beowulf! We can make him tall or we can make him...not so tall! Snowman!" - Cannibal the Musical


[This message has been edited by Kevin M (edited 02-06-2001).]

[Ratboy]

If you like a story, you can rationalize any deficits there may be.

That is so true.

Getting back to The Game, I liked the story, so I was able to suspend my disbelief and accept that CRS's psychological testing was so thorough that they could know exactly how Nicholas Van Orton would react to any situation. However, I know that it is far fetched, so someone less enamored with the story could reasonably be expected not to accept the leap in logic.

Clearly, the more one likes a movie, the more willing one is to overlook it’s flaws.

[1138]

OK, enough name calling. SSASS, next time a smilie would help in cluing in that you're joking.

Mani: I actually meant to mention that I can understand that you just didn't like the movie. I actually was ho-hum on The Game. Though I'm not too fixated on the flaws/questionables in the plot, I'd be more harsh on them because of my less than stellar thoughts of the movie. I wasn't trying to tell you that you're wrong with your opinions. After all, this is subjective stuff.

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1138
Hardware forum moderator | DVDFile Forum Greeter
Floyd is pink. Lando is a sex machine.

[SeanL]

Well, here's one for you.... I disliked Fight Club so much I didn't finish watching it. Something about the characters?..... can't quite place it. Just turned me off. I liked SE7EN, and thoroughly enjoyed The Game.
I guess Fight Club is one of those movies that either you like it or you don't.
Maybe one day I'll rent it again, and make sure I wasn't being overly sensitive.



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Sean

It wasn't me, I didn't do it, you can't prove a thing...

[Eye]

Hmmmm. . .you guys bring up some interesting thoughts about Fight Club. I think I'll rent it and watch it again. Maybe I viewed this movie through the wrong meniscus.



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Eye | Moderator | ICQ: 44594001 | eye@mail.dvdfile.com | Visualize world violence.

[Miggy]

Taxi,

You start a thread to split off the Fight Club discussion and then what happens. People start talking about The Game! What can you do?

Mani,

You keep saying, "I know, I know! It's all from Jack's perspective!" but then you go on to say you don't understand how they can be in the same room at the same time in front of other people. You can understand people's confusion in trying to convince you this movie wasn't (in our opinion) "sloppy". Anyway, don't take mine or anyone else's post as an attack on your taste in movies. I think everyone's just anxious to share their love for this great movie and to make sure there's not any possible way you're just not remembering these scenes incorrectly.

Miggy, the Fightin' Thief

[This message has been edited by Miggy (edited 02-07-2001).]

[manigrasso]

I UNDERSTAND it...


I just DON'T LIKE IT!

And, once again, for those that are taking this a bit personal...

I am NOT saying the movie sucked ass. I'm not chastising people who didn't like the movie. I'm saying *I* didn't like the movie and why. "Explaining" the movie isn't going to make a lick of difference, because I don't need an explanation. SSA, maybe the reason I took umbrage is because, in the Game thread, I tried to make this abundantly clear, then you come on with such a nasty comment. Joking or not, it undermined what was said before.

Guys, let's all relax, it's not a religion, it's not a way of life, it's not even a handy dandy microwave egg maker...it's a movie.

There was someone on this forum who delighted in mocking what people liked, if it didn't fit his narrow defiition of what film ought to be. I used to make fun of his philosophy, which seemed to be "If you don't like it, you're too stupid to get it." I now feel like many of you need to be told the same. I got it, I understand what the director was going for, I just don't agree that it's a valid way to tell a story. I went in with an open mind, I'm not a Fincher-basher, and I didn't get out of it what you guys did. Hardly the end of the world. All right? Can we stop waving our e-dicks in the wind and agree on this, for crying out loud?

[P7A77]

Er, not to be rude, but the only person I see getting emotional about the whole thing is mani... but such are the pitfalls of a text-based medium, so I shan't take it as such.

Anyway, I guess we just disagree on what we saw and how we saw it presented. I can understand if you don't like it, I just didn't think it was "sloppy" in any way, not even in the way you described it. I'm not taking issue with your opinion, just your interpretation.

But oh well. My appreciation of the film certainly isn't hampered in any way by your feelings, and I don't see this going any further, so we'll just leave it at that.


But how 'bout that Alien 3, eh?

[manigrasso]

Well, as I said before, I'd love Fox to revisit Alien 3 in a Director's Cut. Even in it's released state, I find Alien 3 to be much closer in tone to the original Alien. DOn't get me wrong, Aliens rocks, but it's more of a rollercoaster ride, and the original was more moody and atmospheric. I found Fincher's style more in keeping to Scott than Cameron.

And trust me, I'm not upset over this at all. I just want everyone to understand that they don't need to explain the movie to me, or key scenes that I've been bitching about. I got it. I understand what Fincher was going for. I just didn't like it.

[Taxi]

Miggy: Yeah, I give up!


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Taxi
DVDFile Forum Administrator

[Groundskeeper Willy]

Ok, let us all take Fight Club for what it is, a comedy, a dark comedy, but still a comedy. It's not some spiritual wake up call or anything along those lines. It is meant to make us laugh.

If you want to pick apart very minute details about the characters' reactions to interacting with Jack and Tyler at the same time, look no further than the stolen car from the airport. The driver who stole the car speaks directly to Jack, not Tyler. In the following sequence when Jack and Tyler are having their little argument in the front seat, the two men in the back look at eachother as if to say; "What the hell is wrong with this guy?". Watch the movie with the Fincher, Pitt, Norton, and Carter commentary. They point out characters' reactions and little clues that link Jack to Tyler.

[1138]

Welcome to the forum Groundskeeper Willy!

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1138
Hardware forum moderator | DVDFile Forum Greeter
Floyd is pink. Lando is a sex machine.

[Tyler Durden]

Hello All

Mani - I respect your opinion and so on and so forth and your dissatisfaction with Fight Club is fair enough - nobody is criticising you for not liking the movie BUT you do say that:

"I just don't agree that it's a valid way to tell a story..."

Yet your arguements as to the story's validity make less sense than the film itself. Perhaps you should watch the film again and listen to the commentaries provided on the DVD or alternatively read the book, these will give you some insight - something you appear to be lacking at the mo.

I have no problem with you disliking the movie but to call it sloppy when it so clearly isn't is just plain silly.

As I AM TYLER DURDEN (Hee Hee) I can assure you that there is nothing in the film that does not tie-in with the gobsmacking revelation at the end.

There are some much weaker celluloid adventures upon which you can vent your frustration that really are sloppy joes - so why not concentrate on those!

Finally, people are explaining the film to you because the point you are making rather gives one the impression that you didn't understand the film at all.

Cheers

Tyler

[tomdkat]

I have to agree with Tyler. I thought the way the story was presented was VERY well done and I really loved the misdirection with the title.

When I first saw it, I was thinking I was going to watch a pure fighting movie. I had absolutely NO idea I was going to learn who Tyler Durden was or about his "army" or any of that other stuff.

I think Fight Club is one of the best modern-day films I've seen.....

Peace.....

Whoa, this movie really gets people's blood up!! You can put me in the camp of Fight Club fanatics (hence the new UserName ). But I think you guys are so passionate about the movie that you haven't read Mani's posts. Clearly, the movie aint his bag. Who gives a shit why he didn't dig it. It's his opinion and I think we'd all agree that he's entitled to it. Almost all of the stuff we comment on here is our own opinions, not scripture.

I think that's one of the things I like most about Fight Club, it's ability to polarize opinion and interpretation of the subject matter as well as the cinematic style in which the story is told.

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"I am Jack's wasted life."
AKA:cyberjeff6
MY DVD LIST

[This message has been edited by I am Jack's User Name (edited 02-07-2001).]

[manigrasso]

Well, thanks for that. It is after all, all I'm saying.

And I will agree about this, even before I saw it, or knew anything about it, I was amazed at how passionately people get over its defense. And I went in hoping I would like it. Sorry Tyler, I didn't. I won't go into that end of it anymore, because it's solely rehashing.

I like to listen to director's commentaries and all but if you're recommending to anyone that they should watch it to understand the movie better, then perhaps the director didn't do his job.

And if a post began on a movie I found sloppy as well, I'd vent my spleen on it, but this thread is, after all, on Fight Club.

Can we agree to disagree on this one? I'm really an OK guy, and my mom says I'm the most handsome boy at school.

[tomdkat]

I also agree with "Jack's wasted life". Everyone is entitled to their opinions and sometimes people try to defend something they feel strongly about when they think it's under "attack" when someone else doesn't share the same enthusiasm.

The same thing happens in the "Linux vs Windows NT/2000" wars that are constantly going on.

One thing that really gets me going (I'm speaking ONLY for myself) is when people voice their opinions in such a way that the opinion is poised more as a fact than their opinion.

Peace......

P.S. By the way Mani, my mom said you were the most handsome boy in school too (next to me of course)! :-)

[manigrasso]

I have nothing new to add...just wanted to make this a hot topic.

I'm still waiting for Shakes the Clown, the Collector's Edition.

[eltravi]

Cost of a Subway Sandwich - $3.00
Cost of a New Computer - $1, 500.00
Cost of a Kiss concert ticket - $20.00

Number of times we've had a "Fight Club" debate - COUNTLESS

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Cinema is everything to me. I live and breathe films -- I even eat them!" -- Lucio Fulci

MGM - I WANT MY "RETURN OF THE LIVING DEAD" DVD

[tomdkat]

Originally posted by eltravi:

Cost of a Subway Sandwich - $3.00
Cost of a New Computer - $1, 500.00
Cost of a Kiss concert ticket - $20.00


Number of times we've had a "Fight Club" debate - COUNTLESS

That was classic....

I surprised you didn't the cost of a new DVD player! :-)

Peace....

[eltravi]

hehe, thnx

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Cinema is everything to me. I live and breathe films -- I even eat them!" -- Lucio Fulci

MGM - I WANT MY "RETURN OF THE LIVING DEAD" DVD