my complaint about Barry Lyndon - DVDfile.com forum for DVD, Blu-Ray, and HD-DVD

esc · 07-07-2001, 08:41 PM

i had never seen BL before and i was about 90 minutes in when i realized that i had to turn on the english subtitles to understand what they were saying in foreign languages. no burned in subs or player generated subs. annoying

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I'm just not used to being chased around the mall
in the middle of the night by killer robots.
-Linda, Chopping Mall

DrDetroit · 07-07-2001, 09:24 PM

You never really miss anything in Barry Lyndon if they're talking in french or german cause the narrator usually tells you what every scene is about beforehand

mahavishnu · 07-07-2001, 09:35 PM

The foreign languages in Barry Lyndon are great, and perfectly understandable even if you don't know the languages. One complaint might actually be that there aren't enough foreign languages in the film - However Kubrick has clearly made the choice to use English wherever the dialogue really matters so as to avoid the use of subtitles. Fair enough considering the importance of the imagery.

Laughing Gravy · 07-08-2001, 12:43 AM

The so-called "imagery" is especially important in this film, 'cause the script, acting, and "plot" are so infuriatingly, sleep-inducingly, mind-numbingly, yawn-provokingly and completely and fucking annoyingly BORING. Watching this movie and waiting for something -- ANYTHING -- to happen is like staring at a spoon for three hours and trying to bend it with the force of your mind. Good luck.

Filmmaker · 07-08-2001, 12:50 AM

Laughing Gravy likes things dat go "BOOM"!

------------------
A curious mix of the best and worst in motion picture entertainment--that's right, it's Filmmaker's DVDTracker list!
...and the fun doesn't stop there--check out how the madness all began with Filmmaker's Laserdisc Tracker list!

Sykes · 07-08-2001, 01:11 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Filmmaker:
Laughing Gravy likes things dat go "BOOM"!

I think I detect a nerve being pricked.

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"Editing is the foundation of the film art."--V. Pudovkin.

Laughing Gravy · 07-08-2001, 01:17 AM

Actually, I dislike movies that go boom. I also think that somebody whose film tracker list includes CHILDREN OF THE CORN, CHARLIE'S ANGELS and ISLAND OF DR. MOREAU should perhaps pause before casting aspersions.

That said, I'll just add that a motion picture should be expected to have motion as well as a picture.

Triple HHH · 07-08-2001, 05:03 AM

The slow pace that Gravy hates about Barry Lyndon is exactly what I love about it. There is a grandeur and sweep to certain scenes, which give the dialogue even more resonance I think. Today's films are thrown in a blender, served MTV "crap-style" with quick cuts and boring dialogue, and with all the movement in the world, there's not much substance to them 99% of the time.

Barry Lyndon, on the other hand, reminds me of the better Kurosawa, John Ford pics where gestures and voices have a more stately grace, like opera. Some shots in BL are stunningly composed, like one with the clouds in perfect composition (this is pre-CGI). These painterly compositions make me admire the film even more -- it sure took a lot of patience and a good eye to make those happen.

Now, I'm not attacking Gravy -- if he didn't like it, he didn't like it. I agree not everyone will CARE about "composition" or "graceful direction"; I just happen like these things. Well, I just wanted to put in how I feel about one of Kubrick's best and often underappreciated film.

Laughing Gravy · 07-08-2001, 08:16 AM

Some reviews, courtesy of Halliwell's:

"The motion picture equivalent of one of those very large, very expensive, very elegant and very dull books that exist solely to be seen on a coffee table." -- Charles Champlin.

"Watching this movie is like looking at illustrations for a work that has not been supplied." -- John Simon.

"All art and no matter.... Far from re-creating another century, it more accurately embalms it." -- Illustrated London News.

I've always believed BARRY LYNDON was made as a colossal joke, just so Kubrick could feel superior by making an intentionally dreadful film and then thumbing his nose at any critics who liked it. Of course, I can't explain THE SHINING, which, although not worse, doesn't seem as intentionally bad as this one, just inept.

Dehrian · 07-08-2001, 10:04 AM

Actually, the deliberately slow pace of Barry Lyndon is what I find so wonderful about the movie.

I mean, really, this is the guy that made 2001. What did you expect, One Flew Over The Tom Jones Nest?

mahavishnu · 07-08-2001, 10:56 AM

Lyndon is Kubrick's best film.

Filmmaker · 07-08-2001, 03:03 PM

Laughing Gravy, did you notice that the link to my DVDTracker list says "the best and worst in motion picture entertainment"? I have nothing to hide--I love things dat go "BOOM" as much as the everyday moviegoer, but I can also recognize and appreciate when somebody, in this case Kubrick, has pushed the parameters of studio filmmaking into the realm of high art. If you didn't dig it, it's no sweat off my back, but posting the negative reviews for BARRY LYNDON was a particularly weak offering, considering that I can show you scathing reviews for virtually every film now considered a classic (e.g. CITIZEN KANE, 2001: A SPACE ODYSSEY, STAR WARS, et al). Lastly, lighten up a little--does every post have to bother with putting in a smiley face so you can recognize when someone's just giving you a hard time?

------------------
A curious mix of the best and worst in motion picture entertainment--that's right, it's Filmmaker's DVDTracker list!
...and the fun doesn't stop there--check out how the madness all began with Filmmaker's Laserdisc Tracker list!

Laughing Gravy · 07-08-2001, 04:39 PM

"Kubrick has pushed the parameters of studio filmmaking into the realm of high art."

Thanks for helping me start off my Sunday with a giggle. And by the way, denigrating all film criticism because there're bad critics and wrong critics would be like skipping all Kubrick films 'cause this one's a turkey: I'd hate to have missed DR. STRANGELOVE.

Finally, not to get personal, but Vishnu's coronation of LYNDON as Kubrick's best film is the only "review" I needed to assure me that this film is as pointless, boring, and pretentious as I thought.

But if you liked it, make sure you see LAST YEAR AT MARIENBAD.

[This message has been edited by Laughing Gravy (edited 07-08-2001).]

Filmmaker · 07-08-2001, 08:59 PM

Originally posted by Laughing Gravy:
denigrating all film criticism because there're bad critics and wrong critics would be like skipping all Kubrick films 'cause this one's a turkey

I'm certainly not denigrating all film criticism, but I am pointing out that your use of negative reviews to support your P.O.V. is a fool's errand, since I can reference half-a-dozen poor reviews for every "classic" film known to Man. Hell, on the flip side, I can direct you to twice as many positive BARRY LYNDON reviews referenced in its theatrical trailer alone. What's the point of using reviews as support? For every one you'll have that says "this", I'll have at least one that says "that". Better to rely on your own intellectual capability to deconstruct a film's merits, but with insightful lines like "fucking annoyingly BORING" and "BARRY LYNDON was made as a colossal joke, just so Kubrick could feel superior by making an intentionally dreadful film and then thumbing his nose at any critics who liked it.", maybe I should reconsider my suggestion...

------------------
A curious mix of the best and worst in motion picture entertainment--that's right, it's Filmmaker's DVDTracker list!
...and the fun doesn't stop there--check out how the madness all began with Filmmaker's Laserdisc Tracker list!

Laughing Gravy · 07-09-2001, 01:12 AM

Well, this is getting pointless and boring too, so I guess we'll just agree to disagree. What I've written and what you've written can stand on their own merits, and I guess we'll let the DVDfilers make up their own minds.

Filmmaker · 07-09-2001, 02:05 AM

Kosher...

------------------
A curious mix of the best and worst in motion picture entertainment--that's right, it's Filmmaker's DVDTracker list!
...and the fun doesn't stop there--check out how the madness all began with Filmmaker's Laserdisc Tracker list!

Grand Admiral Thrawn · 07-09-2001, 05:05 AM

Just for the record, I liked Charlie's Angels. Its just mindless fun. Nothing wrong with that.

mahavishnu · 07-09-2001, 11:41 AM

Yeah, I've got the DVD of Last Year at Marienbad. Your point?

KikuchiyoCM · 07-10-2001, 06:25 PM

Laughing Gravy, Halliwell's Film Guide is a pile of shit, in terms of understanding or reviewing a film that is, the stats are great but the one-liners are kiddies stuff, I certainly wouldn't care what it had to say.

>but Vishnu's coronation of LYNDON as Kubrick's best film is the only "review" I needed to assure me that this film is as pointless, boring, and pretentious as I thought.

Like I thought, Laughing Gravy, you may be a prick, but you're a prick who makes me laugh, and that counts for something I guess

reeltime · 07-11-2001, 05:53 PM

In my opinion, the movie lulls you for the first two hours and then wallops you with the tension of the duel scene. The relatively farcical and low-key unfolding of the story gives the finale a bit more kick.

Not my favorite Kubrick, but I can stand to watch it once every few years.

------------------
Best,

Dave Kramer
http://fromscript2screen.com

07-07-2001, 08:41 PM	#1 (permalink)
esc Stay behind my aura! Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: camrose, alberta, canada	my complaint about Barry Lyndon i had never seen BL before and i was about 90 minutes in when i realized that i had to turn on the english subtitles to understand what they were saying in foreign languages. no burned in subs or player generated subs. annoying ------------------ I'm just not used to being chased around the mall in the middle of the night by killer robots. -Linda, Chopping Mall

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07-07-2001, 09:24 PM	#2 (permalink)
DrDetroit Actor Join Date: May 2001 Location: Vancouver	You never really miss anything in Barry Lyndon if they're talking in french or german cause the narrator usually tells you what every scene is about beforehand

07-07-2001, 09:35 PM	#3 (permalink)
mahavishnu Actor Join Date: Jun 2000	The foreign languages in Barry Lyndon are great, and perfectly understandable even if you don't know the languages. One complaint might actually be that there aren't enough foreign languages in the film - However Kubrick has clearly made the choice to use English wherever the dialogue really matters so as to avoid the use of subtitles. Fair enough considering the importance of the imagery.

07-08-2001, 12:43 AM	#4 (permalink)
Laughing Gravy Actor Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Sacramento, California USA	The so-called "imagery" is especially important in this film, 'cause the script, acting, and "plot" are so infuriatingly, sleep-inducingly, mind-numbingly, yawn-provokingly and completely and fucking annoyingly BORING. Watching this movie and waiting for something -- ANYTHING -- to happen is like staring at a spoon for three hours and trying to bend it with the force of your mind. Good luck.

07-08-2001, 12:50 AM	#5 (permalink)
Filmmaker Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Jupiter and Beyond the Infinite	Laughing Gravy likes things dat go "BOOM"! ------------------ A curious mix of the best and worst in motion picture entertainment--that's right, it's Filmmaker's DVDTracker list! ...and the fun doesn't stop there--check out how the madness all began with Filmmaker's Laserdisc Tracker list!

07-08-2001, 01:17 AM	#7 (permalink)
Laughing Gravy Actor Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Sacramento, California USA	Actually, I dislike movies that go boom. I also think that somebody whose film tracker list includes CHILDREN OF THE CORN, CHARLIE'S ANGELS and ISLAND OF DR. MOREAU should perhaps pause before casting aspersions. That said, I'll just add that a motion picture should be expected to have motion as well as a picture.

07-08-2001, 05:03 AM	#8 (permalink)
Triple HHH Actor Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Governor of California	The slow pace that Gravy hates about Barry Lyndon is exactly what I love about it. There is a grandeur and sweep to certain scenes, which give the dialogue even more resonance I think. Today's films are thrown in a blender, served MTV "crap-style" with quick cuts and boring dialogue, and with all the movement in the world, there's not much substance to them 99% of the time. Barry Lyndon, on the other hand, reminds me of the better Kurosawa, John Ford pics where gestures and voices have a more stately grace, like opera. Some shots in BL are stunningly composed, like one with the clouds in perfect composition (this is pre-CGI). These painterly compositions make me admire the film even more -- it sure took a lot of patience and a good eye to make those happen. Now, I'm not attacking Gravy -- if he didn't like it, he didn't like it. I agree not everyone will CARE about "composition" or "graceful direction"; I just happen like these things. Well, I just wanted to put in how I feel about one of Kubrick's best and often underappreciated film.

07-08-2001, 08:16 AM	#9 (permalink)
Laughing Gravy Actor Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Sacramento, California USA	Some reviews, courtesy of Halliwell's: "The motion picture equivalent of one of those very large, very expensive, very elegant and very dull books that exist solely to be seen on a coffee table." -- Charles Champlin. "Watching this movie is like looking at illustrations for a work that has not been supplied." -- John Simon. "All art and no matter.... Far from re-creating another century, it more accurately embalms it." -- Illustrated London News. I've always believed BARRY LYNDON was made as a colossal joke, just so Kubrick could feel superior by making an intentionally dreadful film and then thumbing his nose at any critics who liked it. Of course, I can't explain THE SHINING, which, although not worse, doesn't seem as intentionally bad as this one, just inept.

07-08-2001, 10:04 AM	#10 (permalink)
Dehrian Actor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: CA	Actually, the deliberately slow pace of Barry Lyndon is what I find so wonderful about the movie. I mean, really, this is the guy that made 2001. What did you expect, One Flew Over The Tom Jones Nest?

07-08-2001, 10:56 AM	#11 (permalink)
mahavishnu Actor Join Date: Jun 2000	Lyndon is Kubrick's best film.

07-08-2001, 03:03 PM	#12 (permalink)
Filmmaker Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Jupiter and Beyond the Infinite	Laughing Gravy, did you notice that the link to my DVDTracker list says "the best and worst in motion picture entertainment"? I have nothing to hide--I love things dat go "BOOM" as much as the everyday moviegoer, but I can also recognize and appreciate when somebody, in this case Kubrick, has pushed the parameters of studio filmmaking into the realm of high art. If you didn't dig it, it's no sweat off my back, but posting the negative reviews for BARRY LYNDON was a particularly weak offering, considering that I can show you scathing reviews for virtually every film now considered a classic (e.g. CITIZEN KANE, 2001: A SPACE ODYSSEY, STAR WARS, et al). Lastly, lighten up a little--does every post have to bother with putting in a smiley face so you can recognize when someone's just giving you a hard time? ------------------ A curious mix of the best and worst in motion picture entertainment--that's right, it's Filmmaker's DVDTracker list! ...and the fun doesn't stop there--check out how the madness all began with Filmmaker's Laserdisc Tracker list!

07-08-2001, 04:39 PM	#13 (permalink)
Laughing Gravy Actor Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Sacramento, California USA	"Kubrick has pushed the parameters of studio filmmaking into the realm of high art." Thanks for helping me start off my Sunday with a giggle. And by the way, denigrating all film criticism because there're bad critics and wrong critics would be like skipping all Kubrick films 'cause this one's a turkey: I'd hate to have missed DR. STRANGELOVE. Finally, not to get personal, but Vishnu's coronation of LYNDON as Kubrick's best film is the only "review" I needed to assure me that this film is as pointless, boring, and pretentious as I thought. But if you liked it, make sure you see LAST YEAR AT MARIENBAD. [This message has been edited by Laughing Gravy (edited 07-08-2001).]

07-08-2001, 08:59 PM	#14 (permalink)
Filmmaker Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Jupiter and Beyond the Infinite	Originally posted by Laughing Gravy: denigrating all film criticism because there're bad critics and wrong critics would be like skipping all Kubrick films 'cause this one's a turkey I'm certainly not denigrating all film criticism, but I am pointing out that your use of negative reviews to support your P.O.V. is a fool's errand, since I can reference half-a-dozen poor reviews for every "classic" film known to Man. Hell, on the flip side, I can direct you to twice as many positive BARRY LYNDON reviews referenced in its theatrical trailer alone. What's the point of using reviews as support? For every one you'll have that says "this", I'll have at least one that says "that". Better to rely on your own intellectual capability to deconstruct a film's merits, but with insightful lines like "fucking annoyingly BORING" and "BARRY LYNDON was made as a colossal joke, just so Kubrick could feel superior by making an intentionally dreadful film and then thumbing his nose at any critics who liked it.", maybe I should reconsider my suggestion... ------------------ A curious mix of the best and worst in motion picture entertainment--that's right, it's Filmmaker's DVDTracker list! ...and the fun doesn't stop there--check out how the madness all began with Filmmaker's Laserdisc Tracker list!

07-09-2001, 01:12 AM	#15 (permalink)
Laughing Gravy Actor Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Sacramento, California USA	Well, this is getting pointless and boring too, so I guess we'll just agree to disagree. What I've written and what you've written can stand on their own merits, and I guess we'll let the DVDfilers make up their own minds.

07-09-2001, 02:05 AM	#16 (permalink)
Filmmaker Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Jupiter and Beyond the Infinite	Kosher... ------------------ A curious mix of the best and worst in motion picture entertainment--that's right, it's Filmmaker's DVDTracker list! ...and the fun doesn't stop there--check out how the madness all began with Filmmaker's Laserdisc Tracker list!

07-09-2001, 05:05 AM	#17 (permalink)
Grand Admiral Thrawn Actor Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Ohio	Just for the record, I liked Charlie's Angels. Its just mindless fun. Nothing wrong with that.

07-09-2001, 11:41 AM	#18 (permalink)
mahavishnu Actor Join Date: Jun 2000	Yeah, I've got the DVD of Last Year at Marienbad. Your point?

07-10-2001, 06:25 PM	#19 (permalink)
KikuchiyoCM Actor Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: United Kingdom	Laughing Gravy, Halliwell's Film Guide is a pile of shit, in terms of understanding or reviewing a film that is, the stats are great but the one-liners are kiddies stuff, I certainly wouldn't care what it had to say. >but Vishnu's coronation of LYNDON as Kubrick's best film is the only "review" I needed to assure me that this film is as pointless, boring, and pretentious as I thought. Like I thought, Laughing Gravy, you may be a prick, but you're a prick who makes me laugh, and that counts for something I guess

07-11-2001, 05:53 PM	#20 (permalink)
reeltime Actor Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Seattle, WA	In my opinion, the movie lulls you for the first two hours and then wallops you with the tension of the duel scene. The relatively farcical and low-key unfolding of the story gives the finale a bit more kick. Not my favorite Kubrick, but I can stand to watch it once every few years. ------------------ Best, Dave Kramer http://fromscript2screen.com